Season 2 Kickoff: Grit, Growth, and Global Perspectives
Arun: All right, Hype
Network, we are back.
Here we go!
Season
Ps Adam: 2!
Oh, we just decided it's season 2!
Silky smooth season?
I don't know.
Yeah, we're coming back.
We're silky, we're smooth.
And it is season 2.
That's kind of cool.
I think we just Off the cuff.
That one?
Arun: Yeah, I do.
And I like it.
I like the idea of just a, a
refresh going into, it's like
the first day of school again.
It's, it is, it is school really is.
It really is.
We're back.
Ps Adam: Um, I forgot to pack my lunch
, but no test you missed, so it's all good.
Right?
It's like you, you should have
brought butter chicken for today.
Oh, I,
Arun: one of
Ps Adam: these days.
We're gonna do a one of these days.
Wouldn't it be Do like a live eat podcast?
Yeah.
Arun: Yeah.
Do you ladies like spicy food?
Proper spicy food.
How, how spicy, what is proper?
Indian spicy, like if I bring
it, it's gonna be spicy.
Ps Adam: Yeah, but I think
everyone says that, and then
it's a little underwhelming.
No, no, no.
I was in
Ps Vance: Hyderabad one
time, and the food is spicy.
The biryani?
Yeah, yeah.
Okay, if it says it's spicy, it's spicy.
It's, it's, it's spicy.
Did you guys ever, uh, you
know, in school, Trade food.
Oh yeah.
Did you guys do that?
Did
Ps Adam: you?
That's definitely not an Australian thing.
Really?
No.
Ps Vance: No, that's so American.
Like what do you trade?
The marketplace of food trading.
It's hot.
In the schoolyard.
In the schoolyard.
Yeah.
Like you would trade desserts.
Like I had gummy bears.
You had the good parents.
You had tikka masala.
I did.
No, no, no.
My
Arun: food was not tradable.
Within Indians, it was tradable.
I had a market for my food.
Yeah, it really was.
I'm not going to lie.
Fish sauce wasn't tradable either.
The cool parents got snacks
like gummies or like Oreos.
So
Ps Adam: you would trade,
um, like unsealed items.
Oh yeah.
Wow.
Arun: Yeah.
Kids were, that's a good old days.
You know, kids
Ps Adam: today, like we would
do the Halloween trick or treat.
And, uh, like if anything was not
sealed, it could be like not canceled.
Right, right,
Ps Vance: right, right,
Ps Adam: right.
Tootsie rolls, because they're
like, you could unwind them.
Yeah.
It had to be sealed.
Ps Vance: We're in a new world.
I mean, I remember the good old
days when we used to walk to school.
Right.
Right.
Like that doesn't happen.
Vince
Ps Adam: just turned 35 yesterday.
Happy birthday.
Now he's joined the club where you
can talk about the good old days.
I'm in my mid thirties,
heading into my late thirties.
Arun: When did that happen?
Do you think?
Cause I've been doing it recently,
but I'm not even good old days.
Yeah.
The good old days.
Ps Vance: I think you 35.
Arun: Yeah.
Do you think
Ps Vance: that that's when,
that's when the shift is?
How old are you?
Arun: 33, turning 34.
Ps Vance: Wow.
You're an
Arun: early,
Ps Adam: an
Ps Vance: early look back.
You're still in the good old days.
You
Arun: know what it is?
It's around, like we've talked
about this before, but it's
around like people doing work.
I feel like.
We're like the last, my generation
is like the last generation
to really want to do work.
And then you see people coming up
and they're all taking like the
shortcuts and like the easy way out.
So that's, that's when I've gotten to
So you feel like you're on the, on the
Ps Adam: final
Arun: frontier
Ps Adam: of people actually want to work.
Arun: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Like people grinding.
And I don't know if it's, you know,
hanging out with people, but I
just, I genuinely feel that way.
And so that's all the good
old days I'm talking about.
They're the good old days.
Yeah.
When people had grit.
Yeah.
I wouldn't quit.
Yeah.
You really fight through stuff.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Nobody has this anymore.
I'm the last generation with beards.
Ps Vance: Do you think that
AI is going to remove even the
need for grit and resilience?
Or is that like a principle that's just
going to hold true even when robots exist?
Ps Adam: Ooh, I, I, I don't, I
think, I don't think there was.
Ever a world I could forecast that
the grittiest people don't succeed.
So resilience is still
needed in the era of robots.
I think it's needed even more, even more.
Okay.
Because, uh, there is for it to be a
successful person to be an outlier.
All it's going to require is grit.
But for those people, there's going to be
so much stuff that can be done for you.
Right.
Uh, the only differentiator,
differentiator is going
to be those who have grit.
Arun: Good.
Yeah.
No, I totally agree.
Um, and so we have an action
packed podcast this week.
Do you guys want to jump
into any highlights?
Yeah.
I'm
Ps Adam: very excited to jump into
what you've got on the docket today.
Okay.
Arun: So no highlights from like what you
guys have been doing over the last month.
Just jump right into it.
We can't cause we have
an action packed docket.
So do you guys want anything?
Quick highlights.
Summer.
Ps Vance: Summer.
Ooh, summer highlights.
Uh, well, we actually just got,
uh, done with our overflow summer
summit, which was really, really cool.
We're big believers in obviously in person
interaction, and I just get more and
more convinced and convicted when I bring
my team together, how necessary it is.
Um, just in seeing
people's pattern of work.
Uh, cause we did a lot
of coworking that week.
It was highly productive, but then you
just start realizing how people actually
work in person and some people are just.
Wow, better than I expected.
And some people are like,
wow, you don't work.
And so there's just like a lot of
things to be able to address because
you get to see it up close and personal.
Um, and then you can't have a
summit without having to actually,
you know, climb up a summit.
And so we took the team to mission peak
in the East Bay and most people made it.
Most people made it.
The people that didn't,
it is a, a perf reviews.
Uh, but it's also like
a rude awakening, right?
If you can't summit mission P, it's
not easy, but it's not impossible.
It's not half
Ps Adam: done.
No,
Ps Vance: no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.
If you're a millennial, you should be
Arun: able to mission.
Have you done?
I haven't.
I haven't.
It's on my bucket list video,
but it's on my bucket list.
But that's, that's like, wow.
That's like hardcore hiking.
Ps Vance: Yeah.
No, like my, my Filipino
auntie can do Mission Peak.
That's what I'm, if you're a millennial,
you should be able to do Mission Peak.
Exactly.
Yeah.
That's fair.
That was one of the highlights,
a lot of things that happened.
But yeah, my kids started
school together is.
Uh,
Ps Adam: I feel like I spent most of
summer abroad, to be honest with you.
Yeah, that's right.
You've been traveling
a ton of time in Italy.
Uh, we did some time
in Maui that's abroad.
Um, and, uh, we last week actually had a
really great opportunity to visit a couple
of very innovative, but also historical
companies got to, uh, visit and speak
with the CEO of Italy's oldest company,
500 year old company, 15 generations
of legacy and, uh, got to have lunch
with the current CEO, Franco Beretta
and his son, Carlo, who is the heir
apparent, um, ton of learnings from that.
Very, very good trip.
And then also on that trip got to go to,
uh, the fashion brand Brunello Cucinelli
and, uh, had lunch with the CEO there.
And, uh, uh, Honestly, it
was, it was so insightful.
All the things that I learned
different way to do business, very
much an anti or a polar perspective
to business in the Silicon Valley.
Um, where I would say that what
summarized the Silicon Valley
is profit over everything.
Um, their profit.
Is I wouldn't even say profit is second.
I would, I would probably say profit is
maybe a third on the rank of priority.
Um, which is really intriguing when you're
actually in an environment like that.
What's one and two?
I think one and two would
be dignity would be one.
Um, and uh, longevity.
Wow.
Would be one and two.
Arun: When you mean like a legacy,
like legacy, something legacy, like a
Ps Adam: legacy, generational
legacy, that the mindset is this is
going to stay in our family line.
Uh, and, um, but dignity is first,
you know, bringing dignity back
to work, dignity back to arts, uh,
culture, all that kind of stuff.
And, uh, if that eats into
the profit margin, so be
Arun: it.
That's something that's
definitely something I forgot.
I think it was all in podcasts.
I forgot what company they were
talking about, but they were
talking about shifting the.
The business to like figuring out who
in the family they should give it to.
Um, and it was like breaking up the family
and they're trying to figure it out.
Right.
I forgot what company was that,
but it was like all about profits.
Oh, Murdoch's Murdoch's.
There it is.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Ps Adam: The real life succession.
Right, right, right.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I think it's, it's fascinating because,
um, you know, you've, when you look at
the generations of, uh, so when you go to
the Beretta, uh, museum, Beretta factory
They're on their wall in several places.
They've actually got the generational
family line, 15 generations.
And you just look at the branches and the
families and, and the line of succession.
And, uh, it's fascinating because, you
know, even in a generation where there
was two sons, it was evident which
son was the CEO who was going to be
the, and it's not always the oldest.
And it's just, it's funny how it works.
Yeah,
Ps Vance: it is interesting, right?
Like I can just imagine I
wasn't there with you, but.
If you are part of a
generational line, right.
That's carrying on a
brand or an organization.
You must feel the weight of that.
Arun: It's interesting
Ps Vance: that some of the books in
the Bible start with the lineage.
Yeah.
Right.
Cause there's something in a multi
generational aspect of the organization.
I
Ps Adam: think there's something really
key about that with, uh, you know, cause
I think you could, you could see the next
generation as a squandering generation.
Yeah.
They've never had the grit,
they've never had to earn it.
They've just kind of stepped into somewhat
for these companies, luxury, you know, a
lifestyle of not pioneering, but yet these
particular companies have successfully.
Passed on the baton or the values and
the mission to each generation where they
are in any way, in many respects, the
best person to take over because they
have the heartbeat, they have the, the
heritage, and they have the, I guess,
the focus on keeping it, you know, So
Ps Vance: when you met the son of
Brunello Cuccinelli, who's running
the company now, did you get a sense
that his father, you know, forced him
to go through unnecessary hardship?
Um, so to build that grit, or
do you think it just happened?
Look different and he
just caught it in the
Ps Adam: atmosphere or what?
So really interesting about
brunello is he doesn't have sons.
He has daughters.
Oh, and so ricardo stefanali.
He's the ceo He's the son in law.
Got it.
Got it of brunello.
So he married one of these
daughters and um, this guy's
impressive He is a very impressive.
Uh Um, young man, I say young man,
cause he's a year younger than me.
So I kept calling him young
man and, uh, we were having a
great joke, but he's very sharp.
He's, he's very intentional on
carrying, uh, what his father in
law wants to do to really make the
dreams and the mission come true.
Side note, he spoke good English.
Great English.
Yeah.
Very, very astute, very sharp.
Um, I mean, they're very global brand.
Yeah.
So he's traveling all over the world.
Um, and, uh, yeah, just, but come from
a small town of Solomeo, like it's, I
mean, it's, if you go to where the town
is, the whole town has been transformed
by this company, um, and they've really
kind of put back into the town and the
whole world is different because of it.
Pretty much everyone in the town,
cause it's a small works at the factory
and, uh, they all have lunch together.
This is crazy.
Like at 3000 workers that all
file at the same time and you
have lunch with all the workers.
It's really cool.
It's kind of like a, like a.
A Google Apple vibe, but way more
intentional and way more family, you know,
so it's not like you go out with a tray.
It's you, you book a seat.
You can't book a table.
So you, you reserve a seat.
And that seat, you could be sitting
next to who knows, but you're forced
to talk to people, not just people in
your cubicle or people, you know, right.
And so the very family, but, um,
so many values that they have, um,
that he is carrying, but with also
the, the heart for innovation.
But keeping really where they
are, they, they do this thing
called gracious, gracious growth.
And I thought it was a, it was a beautiful
term that I had them unpack because I'm
like, what is gracious growth for them?
Gracious growth is putting
dignity back into work.
So hand sewn, um, handmade, uh,
arts, skill, craft, a labor of love.
And you know, they've had this one
seamstress we met, she's 83 years old.
And, uh, she's a very expensive hire,
you know, in, I think in America we
would go, well, you've just aged up
so much that now you're too expensive.
We can get someone younger to do that.
Uh, but they're putting dignity back
into valuing her on the team and her
experience and all that kind of stuff.
And I think that's why the product
is in my mind valued so highly.
Um, I, I try not to say expensive, but
it is an, it is quite an investment to
purchase a Brunello Cuccinelli garment.
Yeah.
Um, but they just value it at
the labor that goes into it.
Arun: Yeah.
That's really interesting.
You say that cause there's actually
a minor controversy with Google just
released an ad about Gemini and AI.
And they had this part in the ad
where they asked AI to write a letter.
To like their hero.
Um, and everybody was like,
that's so out of touch.
Like we, you know, AI should be
writing letters to other people.
It should be like something that
comes from you, from your heart.
And then Google, I kind of took down the
ad, but it comes to like the different
in difference, maybe in cultures where
here we're so fast moving, where we're
like anything that can speed up the
process to get us to the end goal
where there's like, maybe we need
to slow down and be more intentional
with, you know, what we're building.
So that's pretty cool.
Correct.
Um, yeah, very interesting meeting
other people from different areas
and kind of learning from them.
Yeah.
Um, and on the topic of legacy,
we've got to talk about Olympics,
winning gold medals for your country.
Um, there's a lot of stuff that happened,
you know, from the opening ceremony to,
you know, um, you know, a very particular
performance that we'll touch on.
But I just wanted to start with the
Olympic ceremony because people would love
to hear your thoughts about all of it.
For people that don't know, um,
the Olympic ceremony started with
a version of what some are saying.
It's debatable now that look
like the, the last supper.
Um, some people are saying it
wasn't, some people are saying it is.
Um, but if you go look online, you
can make that judgment for yourself.
You know, personally, I thought it was.
Um, and so, um, a lot of people are saying
it was like a mockery of Christianity.
And so, you know, where
do we stand in all this?
Um, since then, the director
of the, um, performance has
come out and apologized for it.
Oh, he did?
Yeah, he said he didn't mean any offense.
So, um, he said that wasn't the intent.
It was meant to be, uh, you
know, about love and inclusion.
Um, but, you know, there it is.
Yeah, I don't mean
Ps Adam: any offense.
But we're gonna have
transgender people, right?
You know, convulsing or stay in blue
because that's what the Olympics are
about That's exactly what it's all about.
Hey, look, I personally
I think is no doubt.
It was a mockery of the Last Supper that
you know is You got the Louvre there.
You've got art.
You've got their modern take on it.
I think What, what I'm, I'm not surprised.
I mean, France is a very secular country.
They have very secular laws and you have
to abide by their secular laws there.
Um, and, uh, that's kind of
their statement to the world.
They're very, they're pushing a button.
My thing is what I would love to do.
I would love to talk to
every Christian who's easily
offendable and say, settle down.
What did you expect?
They expect Christians to be
complimented when they pick on
Christianity because that's what
Jesus said, expect persecution,
expect the, expect these things.
So it should be like,
Oh, there they go again.
What a compliment.
They're not picking on Buddhism.
They're not picking on Islam.
They're not picking on
any of these things.
Now people could argue, well,
they're afraid of, you know,
Muslims, not Christians.
No, it's just that christianity is real.
You don't go after something that's
fake Okay, you go after what's real
because it's a pain point And so every
time they go after christianity Let it
be another notch to say see I know you
know This is real, but you have to try
and pull it apart and deny the truth the
Ps Vance: tactic of Oh, like we
just need to be a people that
are not bullied You know like
like muslims they do that better.
It's kind of like Is that Jesus's way?
Ps Adam: No, no, no.
Because I think in, in, in the Muslim
religion, uh, revenge and vengeance
is very much permissible, but how
does Jesus teach us how to love?
Exactly.
Romans 12, he says, uh, love your enemies.
He says, you know, in doing so,
um, I mean, you're going to preach
on this in a couple of weeks.
Yeah.
In doing so you're heaping
calls on their head.
Um, so, you know, just love them.
Arun: Yeah.
And there's like power in patience, right?
Yeah.
It's easy to kind of, you know,
Ps Adam: Get reactionary.
Yeah, get reactionary.
Get defensive.
Yeah.
Arun: I mean, one of the common things
you saw was boycotting the Olympics and
I'm not going to watch, like punishing
all the other athletes for, you know.
Yeah.
Ps Adam: But I mean, okay,
you think about this in life.
When someone makes a gap, a jab at you or
accusation, it only hurts if it's true.
Arun: Yeah.
Ps Adam: So, so if someone
says, um, Hey Vince, you're a
tool and you go, no, I'm not.
Okay.
Arun: It's rooted
Ps Adam: in truth, right?
Oh, she showed you back away.
Tiptoe back.
But if you go, yeah, I am a tool, you
know, it's like, what doesn't hurt me.
It doesn't affect me because
there's no truth in it.
But I think that's where the enemy
goes after us too, because always gets
these things that are element of truth.
That's where the hurt comes from.
Ps Vance: Isn't that the enemy, what
the enemy wanted is for, Christians
to not watch the Olympics for
Christians to not be engaged with
the Olympics for Christians to to
ignore that space now to run away from
that isn't that that what the enemy
actually wants I think I think the
Ps Adam: enemy wants Christians
to be anti everything.
Yeah, and for me to see some of
my friends in ministry saying
I'm boycotting the Olympics.
I was like, come on.
So, you know, Uh, I, I kind of put
a post out a couple of days later
cause a couple of our guys from Vive.
Arun: I didn't know that by the way.
That is so cool.
Yeah.
They, they won
Ps Adam: a bronze in the gymnastics.
Uh, they go to Stanford and, uh,
you know, here we are, uh, just
as some of the teams here and,
and just really celebrating them.
And you've got Christians in the Olympics
who, uh, now like got Christians watching
the Olympics saying, we're not watching.
Yeah.
So it's like.
No, you should be more christian.
Yeah.
Ps Vance: Yeah, and what I meant when
I said like, what did you expect?
It's like what what did
you expect from france?
That's right.
You know what I mean?
Like right like why are we shocked?
Yeah Um, I like your perspective of like
if anything let's take it as a compliment.
Um, hey, we're in the conversation
uh, and you know what I mean by
what do you expect as well is Maybe
we've departed our post in france.
Arun: Hmm Perhaps
Ps Vance: maybe we don't have, you
know, Bible believing Christians
in those spaces anymore, which
is why that can just fly, right?
There's no dissenting contrasting opinion.
Honestly, though, I thought
Ps Adam: like given the state of politics,
even in America, I would not be surprised
if we came up with something worse.
Like, I mean, if we were throwing
rocks at, at Paris or France and that
that's indicative of who they are
historically, uh, but right now, the
way that a lot of the politics has gone
in America, I wouldn't be surprised if
when's the next Olympics here, 20, 30,
Arun: I think.
Oh, really?
Yeah.
Um, in
Ps Adam: LA it's in 2028.
Okay.
Wow.
Okay.
Um, look out.
I mean, look out.
Look out.
Yeah.
Christians, fasten your seatbelts.
Yeah.
Um, unless there is some learnings that
they've got from this Olympics, if,
if, uh, that hadn't happened, maybe.
We would have had the most flamboyant
transgender, um, you know, cross
dressing person as the icon.
Ps Vance: Yeah.
And I think that there is a
difference between, uh, you
know, speaking truth, right.
Um, to these things
and disengaging, right.
If anything, these should be
great invitations for Christians,
um, to meaningfully engage
and not just fully disengage.
Boycott, run away, right?
If anything, we should be running towards.
Yes, I agree.
Ps Adam: And I think sometimes
I like to just, I like to think
through the lens of Jesus is Jesus
in heaven going, Oh, I'm so offended.
That was my last supper.
Like, like, like I'm trying to
be an offended person, like,
Arun: like,
Ps Vance: so true.
Huh?
Yeah.
We've kind of even like, um,
idolize that moniker of that.
Yes.
Yeah.
That's true.
Ps Adam: That image is an artwork.
Yeah.
Okay.
Yeah.
To start with.
It's a, it's an artist's
rendition that had, that firstly
wasn't a Middle Eastern table.
Wasn't there's a high seated,
you know, just so, Okay.
Are they mocking the rendition of
the Last Supper or are they mocking
Jesus and the actual Last Supper?
I don't think Jesus is
easily offendable at all.
So let's be like Jesus.
Are we offended for Jesus or are
we offended for our sensitivities?
Yeah.
I
Ps Vance: was, I mean, in that, what,
something that has been challenging me a
little bit, uh, when I was on, Uh, 13 year
anniversary trip with Kim, like, cause
you don't, I'm usually on a schedule like
doing a billion things and then you're
on vacation and you're like, huh, I'm
just going to read the Bible all day.
Like, you know, and I was just kind
of reading through Mark and just that
reminder of Jesus reclined with sinners.
I was just meditating on that a bit.
I was like, wow.
Like.
Reclined like, and I was, I was, I
was looking that up and, you know,
de facto there, uh, is reclining in
the Jewish dinner context because
it was a very intimate thing
to invite somebody to your home
Arun: and
Ps Vance: have dinner because the way in
which actually to your point, the way in
which they had dinner was actually kind
of on couches, reclining, laying right
with each other and things like that.
And, um, that was like, Jesus's ministry.
So,
Ps Adam: so let's take that right.
So Jesus reclined with known sinners.
Yeah.
Okay.
So the people who are getting
offended at the mockery of, of
Christianity, if we put it in that
category, you're the same person
who's not dining with known sinners.
Exactly.
Cause you're too offended.
You're too offended.
You're going to be super
offended anytime I say anything.
Ps Vance: Yeah.
And then we get stuck in our echo
chambers and then we, we just, we keep
dwindling as a people group because it's
just, we're selecting who we, we want.
So to your
Ps Adam: point, I'm boycotting.
That's a retreat.
It's a retreat.
I'm pulling out of the Olympics.
I'm retreating.
You're, you put up something so offensive.
You push me back.
Arun: Yeah.
Ps Adam: No, come on.
I went meant to
Arun: invade space for sure.
I want to say this.
Isn't this like something that happened
just in the Olympic, it's almost every.
Event.
That's controversial and even
towards like, for example, when I was
growing up, rap music was a big deal.
Like my family wouldn't let me listen
to rap music because it was like
going to corrupt your mind, but it
was like, you can be in that space.
Like it's not rap music.
That's the issue, right?
It's the people in it, but maybe
we should be in that space.
Maybe the entertainment
business, there should be more.
Christians in that space to kind of
change the tune and I just want to touch
on this question for you about running
Away, it actually happens in the church
too You get something that happens that
affects you in church and the response
isn't i'm gonna fix this or address
it in church I'm, just gonna run away.
Tell me about that.
That's interesting.
So i'm actually just So i'm just
curious why do you think it is that we
our instinct as christians is to run
versus To run towards, I mean, I've
got some thoughts, um, rip into it.
Go for
Ps Adam: it.
Look, I think we're, we're as, as, uh,
humans, it's, I think we over project.
Okay.
And then we set a persona and
then sometimes it's easier.
We take the easy way out.
Oh yeah.
And to, to run away, to bail,
to retreat is the easy way out.
For sure.
Okay.
So I think about it even in the realm of,
uh, something that we've faced over the
years is in the realm of vision giving.
So there's been times to stretch in
faith and make a commitment, you know,
a pledge commitment say hey I'm gonna
I'm believing by faith that I'm gonna
be able to say let's give 50, 000 above
and beyond the tithe to the vision.
Okay.
So whatever that I guess inspiration came
from if I Don't do anything about that and
then it comes to a point close to the end
where I realize I'm not gonna be able to
Fulfill that do I take that as an invoice?
You And because I can't fulfill it,
do I just, is it easier for me just
to cut bait and run and hide or just
be like, Hey, you know what, I'm gonna
do my best but not take condemnation.
Arun: Right.
Ps Adam: But I think people still live
under condemnation live under, under
legalistic mentality that, Oh no, I'm
going to be in trouble if I don't fulfill.
No, I'm not.
No, there's no condemnation
for those in Christ Jesus.
Okay, if you gave it your best
effort, you should be proud of it.
But I think that's just one
indication of why people want
to bail and hide and save face.
Rather than face difficult conversations
that want to make you grow.
Yeah.
Ps Vance: Yeah, I even just go back to
that picture of Jesus reclining here.
Here's the distinction though.
He didn't recline with
sinners to stay there.
He reclined so that he
could redeem, right?
So he could redeem these spaces.
So even when you're talking
about rap music, it's like, Why
were we running away from it?
Why aren't we engaging with it
and seeing how we can be in these
spaces to redeem those spaces.
Right.
But I do agree, I think, um, especially,
you know, my generation, the upcoming
generation, because even just talking
about the topic of grit, because in some
spaces we, That's not been required.
Um, the pattern is take the easy way out.
Right.
And that's a good insight.
I think shame, um, is,
is, is an accuser, right?
Shame will get you to want you to just
take the easy way out because those
tough confrontations, addressing,
acknowledging where you fall in short.
It doesn't have to end in condemnation.
Correct.
Right.
Can it can happen in a deep, it can, um,
it can end in a deeper purpose, right?
You went in, you learn,
what did you learn from it?
Right.
And can we move forward in that?
Arun: Yeah.
And speaking of taking the easy way
out, I need to give you the platform
to be able to respond to, um, Rachel
Gunn, Ray Gunn, on behalf of your
country, if you haven't seen, Australia
sent out their finest breakdancing.
Ps Vance: Well, she went crazy
Ps Adam: viral.
She has a
Arun: PhD.
I didn't even know you could
get a PhD in breakdance.
You can get a
Ps Adam: PhD in cisgender studies.
Okay, there you go.
Doesn't mean you're intelligent
doesn't mean you're competent, right?
Just means you've done
the court classwork.
Arun: Well, she's a 36 year
old university lecturer.
She has a PhD in cultural studies.
Um, she somehow was able to
kind of maneuver her way into
the breakdancing committee.
Or she got her husband on
the breakdancing committee.
She set up a competition.
She won her own competition.
She ended up being elected to
perform on behalf of Australia.
Did
Ps Adam: anybody else compete in this?
Yeah.
So they have videos
Arun: of it and she clearly
didn't win that, but somehow she
was able to, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Husband voted.
Yeah, yeah, exactly.
So now there's all this controversy
about, you know, you had your
husband on the committee.
Oh, this is serious.
Yeah.
Look, I think it's a national, I think
Ps Adam: it is a national disgrace.
And I think that there will be a inquiry.
Uh, there will probably be some, uh,
inquiry from, um, the Commonwealth,
uh, regarding, um, this, this, uh,
poor display and national disgrace.
Um, I, I can say, uh, We
do have better dancers.
All right.
I know we can't prove it,
but I can say we, we, we, you
know what the problem is here?
The problem is the Olympics.
The problem is that you can be a gold
medalist for breakdancing and you
actually an Olympic gold medalist.
But that may never, ever
be in the Olympics again.
I just don't think you should be
able to add particular sports to
the Olympics that can be there one
year and not there the next time.
I just don't think that should be
the, I think they got to be set.
Yeah.
Ps Vance: And there's this whole, it's,
it's kind of still in the theme of, uh,
this buzzword of inclusion, which is.
Such a dichotomy with the Olympics, right?
It's like, you're, you're flying
the flag of inclusion and some
of the most exclusive sports
and athletes on the planet.
Like these, these, some of these
athletes, they're winning by like 0.
005 seconds in a hundred minutes.
And it's like, that's exclusive.
It's
Ps Adam: like, this is
the least inclusive thing.
Zeroing back on the, on the break dancing.
It's not even a sport.
It's an art, it's a dance.
So it's just crazy that.
One particular country who's
hosting it can decide, well,
we're going to add in croquet.
What do you think
Arun: synchronized swimming is?
Is that?
Oh, that's art.
That's art, right?
I think it's definitely in the dancing.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I definitely, yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's just curious.
Cause that one's been in
it for a while, I think.
Right?
Synchronized swimming?
I don't know.
Oh, it's been in it for a while.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Ps Adam: I would categorize that
the first I've heard this argument.
Uh, I think so.
I think it is because you've
got like the set ones.
Right.
Um, and then you get the ones
that are flexible and yeah.
And saying that
Ps Vance: some
Ps Adam: dancers are very athletic.
Arun: Yeah,
Ps Adam: for sure.
Ps Vance: But I don't think
that most people recognize it
at least today as like a sport.
Yeah.
Like, and so
Ps Adam: look, I think, I, I think
Olympic should be individual sports.
Oh, so not even team sports.
No, I don't think basketball.
I don't think rugby.
I don't think soccer.
That's a hot take.
Well, because I mean, not every
country does those sports.
Right, right.
Yeah.
So, you know, it's, it's like, oh, okay.
Well, our country's never even seen rugby.
So, okay.
Well then that's included
in some, some things.
Yeah.
Cricket is included.
And you know, most people don't
even know what a cricket bat is.
So I think, I think the Olympic should
be, um, if you go back to Greek era, it's
an individual versus another individual.
That's where it started in the Greek.
So we've added team sports
and all these other things.
I think it should be.
Yeah.
You know, you're looking for the Olympian.
Arun: Right, right.
And,
Ps Adam: uh, I
Arun: think that,
Ps Adam: I don't know.
Arun: Do you think countries should
be limited in their representatives?
Like, you look at, now people don't
consider gold medal count as Oh,
because America has 4, 000 Yeah, right.
And we still barely Hey, but look,
Ps Adam: despite Rachel Gunn,
look how well Australia did.
Yes, yes, yes, yes.
Well, I think we got
Ps Vance: fourth.
Ps Adam: Yeah.
Ps Vance: And the gold medal count?
Ps Adam: Very impressive.
Ps Vance: Wow.
Cause what?
Swimming?
Just swimming?
Just, no, it was just all
Ps Adam: sports fans, but, um, you know,
there's a lot of medals there to be number
four, a country of 26 million people.
That's less than the, the
population of California.
And, uh, we beat a lot of people,
but swimming is cheating though.
Ps Vance: I feel like
how was like for them?
No, for gold medal count.
Oh, right.
Because, uh, basically
the, the freestyle, right.
Is, and then it's basically,
you just created iterations.
Right, right, right.
A little bit worse.
So it's like backstroke,
butterfly, butterfly.
So everything's a little
bit more inefficient.
Totally agree with that.
I'm like, okay, of course,
Michael Phelps is going to win.
Of course, this Australian guy
is going to win every time.
So it's just a slight
iteration of the same thing.
That's hilarious.
See, this is where
Ps Adam: I think it's like,
it's a false narrative.
And now I'm an American citizen and
look, do I love that America won?
Of course.
But we, we provide like 10 X the amount of
athletes we're in way more competitions.
And if you dominate in swimming or
running, you're going to dominate
with about 30 different medals.
Like you definitely, you know,
and you got this, you know,
obscure country winning ping pong.
And when you're like,
Arun: Wow.
That's
Ps Adam: great.
Totally.
Yeah.
There should be
Ps Vance: waiting to it.
I even just think that like.
Gymnastics, it's impressive to me because
like all those things are very different.
Yeah, like a floor versus ring
Simone Biles She has to have a
different weighting right on what
she does cuz that is crazy Yeah, so
Ps Adam: one goes with
two gold or something
Ps Vance: something like that.
Like let's just be so much
better Right, just be honest like
what Winter Olympics curling.
Come on, like that doesn't
that shouldn't count as much.
That's true That's what Simone Biles did
Arun: Yeah, breakdancing should
be like a different scale, right?
Like a quarter of a point.
A quarter of a point.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, your medal's just smaller.
It's like
Ps Adam: a broken off piece
of one of the real medals.
That's right.
But what did you watch the most?
Arun: Uh, basketball.
I think I was huge into
watching US men's basketball.
I think a lot of the countries are
catching up, which is kind of scary.
We sent out the best, like legends.
We almost lost a couple times.
And we almost lost, if it
wasn't for Steph Curry.
Praise God for Steph Curry.
Ps Adam: So that's what I think.
I didn't think the whole
team should get a medal.
Yeah, that's true.
The MVP of the team should get a medal.
I watched, I
Ps Vance: watched the classics,
um, track, uh, particularly
the sprints and gymnastics.
Those are the most interesting.
They
Arun: really are.
Ps Vance: It's just like, I
Arun: watched a bit of the shooting.
That was really good.
I never watched shooting
until this time around.
So good.
So good.
How about the guy from Turkey?
Gangster.
Turkish James Bond, man.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's so funny that I
think she's from Korea.
I forgot her name by now, but
she had like the full set up.
Yeah.
It looks super swaggy.
Hit it.
And then the next day, this
guy comes out, no equipment.
So he
Ps Adam: did a brilliant quote.
He's like everyone online has
been saying how cool I looked,
but on the inside, it was chaos.
And I thought that is a great quote.
He could have been like, yeah, I was.
No, he's like inside.
It was chaos.
Like he's freaking out,
but he just looks so calm.
So that was like mind over matter.
Mm-Hmm.
. That was cool.
That's crazy.
These guys
Arun: are boss.
All right, so we're, we're gonna
jump right into politics next.
I think we gotta talk about it
from, I think we have to, but
it's actually all within this
topic of inclusion because Okay.
Trump almost got got, and it was because,
oh, we haven't talked since then.
We haven't talked since then.
There was a lot that
happened and it was around.
His security detail.
There's a lot of stuff going
on now with DEI because of
the people that they got in.
Um, if you see video, this isn't
even a, like a opinion piece.
If you watch the videos of like
the entire setup, how they did it.
Um, yeah.
Curious where you guys were when
you guys, when this happened,
cause we were off for a while.
Where were you guys when
you heard about this?
Ps Adam: I was in Italy.
I woke up to it and I couldn't believe it.
I was in, uh, Polignano Amare and I
literally woke up and I remember like
here is still asleep and I'm like, Oh my.
Oh my gosh, is this real?
Cause you know, you first
look at something, is this
fake, is this, what is this?
Um, and since then I've
done some deep dives.
Uh, I've got, I've got
theories on the windows there.
I've got, man, I was, I was
straight onto my, uh, my, uh,
deep fake channels big time.
And, uh, yeah, I've been doing a lot of
research and I know there's a lot going
on and I think I'm particularly in, uh,
in, I guess, interested because, uh, of.
My hobby with shooting and, uh,
with my sniper rifle and just
knowing that it's not an easy setup.
Um, there is so much that goes in.
I think knowing what's involved
to make an accurate shot like
that, there has to be stability.
You have to position
yourself quite stable.
Um, you have to actually line up a shot.
So there was a lot of time.
It's not like someone just quickly
runs and pops something off.
So.
How much went wrong?
Yeah.
Kind of, you have to have a
very good reason to assume
that this was not planned.
Mm hmm.
You know, not planted
and, uh, not overlooked.
So,
Ps Vance: didn't he run
across the building?
Arun: He was spotted maybe hours out.
I don't know how many hours, but
well before all of this getting
set up, climbing up this area
where there was no security set up.
Um, but yeah, he was spotted
this video of people saying,
there's this guy on the roof.
He has a gun.
What's the argument
Ps Adam: for this being staged?
That the shots didn't come
from, you Him on the roof.
Oh.
He was the setup.
Um, but the shots actually came
from the window underneath.
Oh,
Arun: and also there was this thing,
he was in a black rock commercial,
um, before all this happened, like the
connections that he has outside of,
you know, this event, very suspect.
I don't, and also, I don't know what
to believe, but I was also on Twitter
as well, seeing all this stuff pop up.
There's different angles from which
the bullets are, you know, passing by.
People are saying it wasn't
a bullet that hit his ear.
It was shrapnel from
hitting something else.
There's just like.
Well, I think it was a bullet
because you can see it right then
there's that picture or video
Ps Adam: But just okay.
So so when you talk to um
sharpshooters Um, you you know what
it takes to be able to execute on
a shot You need to calm your body.
You need to literally slink down into
a low breath exhale pull the trigger
this was rapid fire and the fact that
Where his ear got shot when he turned
his head that is I mean You have to
either say this is a hand of God moment
or just an incredible fluke because
he was millimeters away from dying.
And, um, the sharp shooter shooting
from, I believe from the window,
the, the young kid, I think is
just a distraction, a decoy.
He was obviously convinced to, we
don't think we caught the shooter.
No, I don't.
I think it's, I think it's FBI.
Ps Vance: Wow.
Inside job.
Yeah.
Inside job.
But they were trying to get Trump.
Yes.
Is what you're saying.
Arun: Wow.
Did you see that?
I don't know if you guys
both saw this picture.
This is a deep state guys.
This angle where he turned his head and
like the difference between like full
civil war chaos in our country was like
that small of a turn that happened.
It just feels like even if it was
staged, that doesn't seem like.
I've
Ps Vance: heard claims of the
staging, but from the Republican
party, they're staging it so that.
They could elevate, you know,
Trump as like this hero.
Arun: Did you see what, and the
reason that I would, okay, we're just
going to play a counterpoint to that
Ps Adam: is a near
impossible shot to stage.
And that's crazy.
That's
Arun: why
Ps Adam: it's like, if you're
a Republican party, you are not
putting your leader at risk.
That was always my logic is like, how
Ps Vance: that's risky.
Yeah,
Ps Adam: risky.
Gun safety is the rule of guns is.
Even when it's unloaded,
you don't point it.
There's so many things.
You don't put a shot past somebody
because there's deviations.
There's so
Arun: many unknowns.
Were you surprised at how
quickly he got back up?
I actually was.
Yeah, I was very surprised.
The Secret Service let him get back up.
So he's an active shooter.
No matter what
Ps Vance: your view on Trump is, he's a G.
He's a G.
Okay.
When he,
Arun: that picture, that
shot of him with the
Ps Adam: flag in the
background is a, okay, I'm
Ps Vance: just saying right
now, I wouldn't have done that.
Ps Adam: Yeah, I wouldn't,
I wouldn't be crying still.
But there are reports, no, no, there
are reports that they were saying,
shoot her down, shoot her down.
So I think that maybe gave him the
confidence to, to kind of pop his head up.
Yeah, but still.
But, if you get hit, With a bullet.
Oh my gosh.
Um, even if it's a neck or
whatever, and you see blood.
Yeah.
Your heart is gonna go a
thousand miles an hour.
Totally.
You'd be like, get me outta here.
You don't know if there's a, that is a,
there's no doubt that that is a gangster.
No, that's gangster.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
You can't doubt that.
We gotta
Arun: put this on the pod.
I'll show you guys.
It's one of, of the best photos of
all time, all time possible that,
that could be set up like that.
Like the flag in the background.
That's what I, that's what I
Ps Adam: also was like Where, but did
you see where the photographer was?
This guy's a gangster, so he's
literally had an interview as well.
Mm-Hmm.
. So he is lowered down.
'cause the, the platform's elevated and.
The other photographers bailed because
there's all these media people down there.
A lot of them bailed.
They're scrambling under
chairs and stuff like that.
So he's like snapping photos
from, from down underneath.
And then he literally said, as
he saw Trump get up and raise his
hand, he'd like, he took the phone.
He's like, I think I just
took the greatest photo.
Arun: For sure.
People are saying that him getting up
was very important for the country,
Ps Adam: that strength,
Arun: like that showing that
strength, that it wasn't
Ps Adam: as America.
Arun: Yeah, that was very important
because the country, like a lot of other
countries see your president go down.
That could have been very scary.
I think whatever you think about
Trump, that was very important for
our country for him to get back up.
Ps Adam: Well, I think we'd love to talk
about what people think about Trump.
I think honestly, what we have with
Donald Trump already, we know is that
other world leaders or dictators.
Putin, uh, Kim Jong Joong, these
leaders have a healthy respect or
fear of Donald Trump that doesn't
exist with current administration.
For sure.
So, a move like that makes them
go, Oh, yeah, even more, yeah,
this guy is on the edge of wild.
Yeah.
Which is.
I don't know.
That's kind of what you
want in a world leader.
Arun: Yeah.
And I will say the argument against
for you were asking about it is that I
was talking to one of my, um, friends
who's, who did a lot of security.
Um, he's been with like
the secret service.
He, I like chatted with
him, see now the work.
And he's actually said, there's been
this pattern of hirings that have
been happening in these services.
Where they don't hire
for merit or skill level.
And so he's actually seen
a lot of these issues.
What do they hire for?
Uh, you know, inclusion
and love, you know.
But then it leads to these
situations where now when you do
need people to kind of go perform
this job They can't actually do it.
And so he said it's it's almost wild to
think that it's a setup It's a setup,
Ps Adam: right?
So so let's look at the left.
The democrats have been the main
proponents of dei Okay, there's there's
Kind of been their agenda, like that's
been the whole Biden administration.
It's DEI.
It's a transgender health minister.
It's a gay transport minister.
It's a, uh, lesbian secretary.
Um, uh, media secretary.
You've got, um, even when he was.
Selecting his vice president Kamala.
They said he's gonna choose from four
one of four black women So everything
was diversity equity inclusion.
Okay, so the other day when Trump's
on stage and he's at the media Black
reporters reporters media and they said
do you think that she was a DEI hire?
I don't understand why he didn't say Yes.
Cause that's what you'd said.
When did the left depart from their
statement that DEI is good to now?
Oh, you're just saying she's DEI.
I I'm just trying to figure it.
I feel like the left still promotes DEI,
Ps Vance: right?
Yeah,
Arun: I think so.
So why was
Ps Vance: that a question?
Yeah.
I'm not sure.
It's known.
Oh, they were just trying
to try to catch him.
Yeah.
I was just trying to do
anything to, to trap him.
I think the large, uh, proportion of
Democrats are still promoting DEI.
Um, You know, Mark Cuban famously
is really, uh, defending DEI.
He's
Ps Adam: got a different version of DEI.
Ps Vance: So that, that's my insight is
if you actually listen to the podcast
with Mark Cuban and Vivek, it's really
interesting because, you know, they're
pretty adversarial, um, and there are
definitely on different sides, but
I respected it from the sense that
Mark Cuban was at least speaking a
little bit intelligently and it seemed
like he was, Defining it differently.
Can you give the
Arun: audience some like,
uh, background into what?
Yeah, I think,
Ps Vance: you know, uh, Mark Cuban is
definitely sticking to his capitalistic
principles and he's saying that, Hey,
look, I use DEI to my advantage because
I recruit in places people are not
recruiting, but I still hold people
to merit type of thing, which I don't
think is the common usage of DEI.
Right.
If we just go back to.
COVID and a lot of the rhetoric and
narrative, there was definitely pressure
on CEOs to make social statements that
maybe they didn't form an opinion on yet.
And you had to sign pledges
and make public declarations.
And that's why people like, um, the CEO
of, and founder of Coinbase, you know,
Brian Armstrong, you know, Retaliated
and came out with pieces of like, no, I'm
not making political statements, right?
Because that definitely existed.
The pressure of making social statements
that maybe people didn't agree with.
Yeah.
Right.
So I don't know if Mark Cuban
is the best representation of
what the actual ideology is.
Um, I do think that You know, when
I heard it, I was like, okay, cool.
Like, but at least they're engaging
in a way that's not idiotic.
Um, but, but it's interesting.
Arun: Yeah.
I'm curious what you guys think,
because we were just talking about
this, about Christians and running away.
But I think the thing that people
are doing is saying, I will
just follow what everybody says.
So I don't have to face any opposition
where it's like, I will go the DEI
route so that I don't have to go
against people saying, and this
is like, you know, people, I think
it's like the hardest thing to do
is taking a stance against the norm.
And I don't think.
Outside of Christianity, I don't
think people do that in general.
So I
Ps Adam: think it's been
a perfect storm, right?
We had, uh, in, you, you, this really
only goes back to its prominence
was probably about four or five
years ago where it really took
its, uh, it's, it's kind of peak.
It had to do with, uh, you
know, COVID cancel culture
had just come through rapidly.
Um, you had George Floyd, Riots, you had
so many people cowtailing to the, the,
the, the, I guess the rhythm or fall into
line or, or who, what do you stand for?
And there was backlash in companies.
There's all these kinds of things.
And I think a lot of weak, wimpy
leaders just, it was easier for them to
not make waves, to hide behind things
and write off a huge amount of their
profit, uh, to go, Hey, let's just,
let's just, no, I don't think anyone.
Believed this was a good idea.
It was just to appease loud people and
at that time loud people had a lot of
sway Until people realized they actually
didn't They didn't have that much sway.
It was just It wasn't
actually a large group.
So, so when you're pastoring, okay.
Um, you'll talk to somebody and they'll
say, Hey, everyone's saying this.
No, when you're young in ministry,
you go, Oh my gosh, the whole church.
It's like, okay, cool.
Give me all the names.
Yeah.
And like, uh, And you're like,
and, and they're like, well,
I've only talked to John so far.
Okay, cool.
So you and John, not everybody.
Right.
And I think that's what they
missed is like, it's a couple of
people loud online and, uh, The
majority of people are just annoyed.
Ps Vance: What I appreciated about Vivek's
run when he was running for president
was that he had this, uh, insight to not
just talk about what he was against, but
to give a vision or maybe even a revision
of, of what America could be right.
And he's even been saying this recently.
Okay.
Let's not even say, make America
great again, let's make America
greater than it's ever been before.
Right?
And so, um, I appreciate that.
I've been thinking about this.
Okay, Biblically, right?
So kind of going through the
book of Mark, you know, it's
an action packed book, right?
It's the, it's the gospel of action.
It's just boom, boom, boom, story,
story, story, healing, healing, healing.
And there's like multiple
times, um, in rapid succession.
It's like, and the, Crowds came
around Jesus and there was, uh,
people coming from this city
and that city and this city, and
they all made their way to Jesus.
And my conclusion kind of going through
the first few chapters and Mark was.
Jesus was a really attractional character.
Like there was something about
Jesus, that word spread and
people were attracted to him.
And so a little bit of my
meditation lately has been.
I believe we should be civically engaged.
I actually love political discourse.
I think we should take a stand.
I think we should make known the
principles and the policies that
are aligned with those principles.
I agree with all of that.
I just wonder, How do we do it in a way
where we don't lose our attractiveness?
And I'm not saying it's about like
necessarily, uh, appealing, like trying
to appeal to people, but there was
something attractive about Jesus, right?
So I like, you know, like that's the
tension that I'm honestly real time.
I'm trying to think, you'll get a
Ps Adam: lot, a big discourse about a
lot of people will say, Hey, Christians
shouldn't be involved in politics.
Um, maybe the premise for that is that
we're, About bringing heaven to earth,
we're spiritual, all that kind of stuff.
Yeah, but you're going to still
spend your whole life here on earth.
And so the world you live in is determined
by your citizenship here on earth.
And so what world we bring in, I
think, is Bringing heaven to earth is
changing the nature of hearth to look
like heaven Yeah to yes bring heavens
definitely virtues and values to here
on earth in politics and you can't
expect the world to do that Yeah,
Arun: I'm curious.
It's actually a very interesting
question that you it's like How do you
do a model where you're not pushing
and people are pulling from you?
Because I think you see a
lot of this right now where
Christians have to be Pushing it.
It feels like you're just preaching and
people are like shutting down, but how do
you get it where you're attractive enough?
Like, like Jesus almost where it's
like, people are coming to you and
trying to get the most out of you.
So how is it that you're in politics,
but maybe it's not about you just
pushing an agenda, but you're doing
it so excellently and it's like
almost a testimony you've got now.
People are coming in.
Yeah.
Look,
Ps Adam: I gotta say,
be true to who you are.
That's the first, that's the first thing.
Don't be a different version of yourself
online than you are in real person.
Okay, I will criticize people who present
this one person online, but they're
actually, so online they're this critic,
and they're like, almost like hardcore.
But in person they're the
nicest, sweetest person.
You're like, hang on,
hang on, hang on, hang on.
Just be the nice guy
online, just be consistent.
So, um, For me, I just know my, my
personality is I provoke, I poke, I, you
know, I kind of do, so I just do that
and I'm going to do it in a fun way.
I want to laugh at myself and laugh at
our politics and, and then also maybe
present something that may be slightly
humorous, but it's got a truth behind it.
Ps Vance: Right.
It's good.
Ps Adam: Yeah.
Cause I want to get people
to think for themselves.
I, the last thing I want to do is tell
people how to think, but I want them
to, Stop their one track thought and
maybe consider a different perspective.
Yeah,
Ps Vance: yeah, yeah.
I definitely think that Jesus
modeled contrast for sure.
Um, I also found that probably
what was attractive is that
he did a lot of healing.
You know, um, he did a lot of healing and
I don't know, maybe a deeper principle
in there is that Uh, you know, how are we
as Christians, especially kingdom minded
entrepreneurs bringing solutions, right?
Um, we've talked about it before,
but like, if we want a seat at the
table, we have to bring solutions.
We can't just be the ones
always criticizing, always anti.
We're not going to actually really
have a seat at the table unless
we also are coming with solutions.
So stand for something, but then come
with a solution to effectuate that change.
Ps Adam: I think he did a lot of healings.
I agree.
I think he also did a lot
of innovative thinking.
Oh, yeah.
Countercultural.
Totally.
So he took a countercultural stance.
You know, the Beatitudes was so
shocking that, you know, he, he would
talk about love your, your enemies
and do all these kinds of things.
And it was like, wow, this is crazy.
Yeah.
And, uh, I think that that's a part
of, yeah, what we should be promoting.
I get worried about the person
who only promotes politics,
but doesn't promote Jesus.
Arun: Wow.
Ps Adam: Wow.
Okay, if you're a christian is there
a balance or are you just so political
that we can't see christ Through you.
Yeah,
Arun: and I want to say one other thing
on that topic of like taking a stance
I feel like people don't know What you
can do until they see it be done So like
can I do something where I'm taking this
stance and then still be successful?
Is that possible to be done?
I think that's where we can kind of
do that where it's like is it possible
to have a company where it's all
Grounded on values that I believe in
not granted on values of the world
believes and still be successful.
Is that possible sure?
So I think if you're out there
and you're trying to figure
out, you know, how do I do this?
That's how you should do it.
By example.
Yeah.
Totally agree.
All right.
Cool.
So, um, we are kind of close to time.
Okay.
Um, we have a few other stuff
that we could chat about.
I
Ps Adam: mean, that is a long list.
That's a long docket.
Arun: Yeah.
Yeah.
We have a while.
Ps Adam: Season two coming
Ps Vance: in
Ps Adam: hot.
Everyone's been out here all the time.
We'll talk about this.
We'll talk about this.
We'll talk
Ps Vance: about.
He's actually been sitting
here the whole time.
Yeah.
We're like, when
Arun: will they, what would
they like to talk about?
We didn't ask where you
were over the summer.
Oh, that's true.
I just got back from Lisbon.
I was at a company off site,
which same reaction to you.
I think those we are fully remote company.
You're in Lisbon.
Yeah, Lisbon, Portugal.
Yeah.
Ps Adam: Yeah on a company off site.
You guys do it large.
Arun: I will say that was the
location pick because it's
actually very affordable.
It's actually very affordable.
Because you're situated in Palo Alto.
Yeah, right, right.
But there's a lot of people
everywhere, you know.
I don't want to get into my
company finances, but, um,
it was really important.
I think every one of these, we get
together and we meet each other.
It's kind of goes to what you guys
are saying is like, once you get to
kind of see somebody in person, that
conversations that you have allow you
to kind of innovate so quickly because.
Talking to somebody online
is way different than talking
to somebody in person.
For sure.
Really seeing how they react, how they,
you know, how, how you speak makes
them kind of change their thoughts.
Yeah.
Seeing that in person is way different.
Body language, body
language, so different.
That's huge.
But it's something that's really funny
that came up with a lot of the engineers.
We had like a week long, like we had three
days of a company wide offsite and then
we had an engineering offsite after that.
By the end of it, you're having
all these technical debates and
you're kind of going back and forth.
And by the end of it, it was
like, How do we do this every day?
How do we see each other every single day?
And I feel like we've kind
of lost some of that, right?
Right.
Like,
Ps Adam: oh no, i'm gonna miss my buddy.
Right.
But no, but
Arun: some people were like,
how do we have these kind of
like hard debates every day?
Yeah.
But like, we've kind of lost some of that
skill of just seeing somebody the other
day and just having these conversations.
For sure.
Very interesting.
That just came up that way.
It's like.
Kind of weak in a way of
like, yeah, it's definitely
Ps Adam: gonna weaken you.
But, but I've got a question.
Yeah.
Uh, I don't know the answer to that one,
but the question I have for you is when
you do this company offsides, cause,
uh, you guys seem to do them pretty big.
Is that a factor in someone's mind?
If they're thinking about jumping ship or
going to a different company, he's like,
Oh, but I'll miss that on the offsides.
Is that the plan for going so big?
Arun: I don't know.
I think it's our company has
not done it for that reason.
It's more of.
We just desperately need it for
people to kind of build relationships.
Um, we do it once a year, this company
I want, you know, if things worked out,
we would like to do it twice a year.
And then we have like the
smaller teams do their offsides.
But I think it's, you can't do a
remote company without doing it.
I don't think that's just possible to do.
Um, either you go back into the office or
you have these scheduled kind of offsides.
And so I think that's the way
our company thinks about it.
And
Ps Adam: so the, the push for
remote companies, you think you
can get the best talent by a
spread of people across the globe?
Arun: Yeah, I think so.
You don't think
Ps Adam: talent is concentrated?
Arun: I don't know.
I don't think so.
I think it could be anywhere.
I think now with remote work, people
are living anywhere, especially.
So now people that used to be,
Ps Adam: let's say
remote work didn't exist.
Do you think how people would concentrate?
Oh, I
Arun: think, yeah, for sure.
I think it used to be
in the Silicon Valley.
Yeah.
Right.
Yeah.
And then once COVID hit now, it's still
kind of is, but yeah, that's true.
It's also distributed.
Yeah.
Do you consider overflow remote company?
We're hybrid.
We're hybrid.
Ps Vance: It's actually 50 50 now.
Okay.
Um, so we have half in
office and half distributed.
Arun: Do you feel like you
guys are going to go full back?
Yeah,
Ps Vance: so, uh, five days.
I don't, I haven't made
a decision on that.
Um, but we will continually exclusively
hire for in person going forward.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So it'll probably be
like 80 20 eventually.
Arun: Yeah.
And you've done this for
your, for the church as well.
You guys have off sites
where you guys do it.
Do you feel like that's the reason you
guys do it to build those relationships?
Ps Adam: I think both and, uh, I,
I definitely believe in the, the
collaboration, uh, moments and the, the in
synergy, you know, that you get the team
dynamic, uh, and we, the reason we do an
offsite is because we're trying to pull
them together from around the globe, uh,
in height, like, I guess, utilize that
week, uh, maximize, you know, expenses,
uh, on, you know, someone's expenses.
They're spending money on a flight,
okay, well, while you're here, instead of
making two flights, that kind of stuff.
So being very diligent with
finances and capitalizing on that.
But the in, like, I guess the, the in
service moment of being able to do things
together in the room, that body language,
that, that, uh, camaraderie, that rapport.
It's
Arun: huge.
Yeah.
It's very big.
Do you guys style your offsite
so that you have cross functional
engagement where it's like usually
you're siloed to your team?
Um, but now during these offsites,
you got to make sure that you have
people from different departments.
So we do, we
Ps Adam: do, uh, it's a very, it's a
very fun, uh, interaction, uh, where
we'll do sessions, uh, set sessions in
like the conference room of the, of the
hotel, and then we'll do set lunches.
So I assign people to have lunch
with each other over the three days.
Um, so they're mixed up and it's
very intentional people that
wouldn't usually kind of collaborate
on something or, or connect.
And then, uh, yeah, we just do group
dinners and we'll seat people specifically
around the tables to, you know, I
like to, at these things, I like to
separate spouses, you know, because it's
kind of like some guys, some fellas.
Find comfort next to the really,
Arun: I
Ps Adam: mean, yes,
Arun: that's me.
, I find the most comfort.
Yes.
Ps Adam: That's funny
shops if you're listening.
Yeah.
Um, but does she listen to
she, she just finished her bar.
So now if she doesn't,
Arun: how did she go?
She said it was very difficult,
but she thought it done.
She just took her one today.
So, come on now she's done.
Now we wait till November and, uh Oh.
That's when you get the results.
That's when you get, why
do they do it like that?
I mean, they gotta manually
Why it takes so long?
They have to manually grab all
the essays and like, ai, we need.
That's crazy.
So now it's a waiting game
until November, but no excuse.
If you're out there, you got to
listen now and I'll be checking
code one, three, three, two.
You gotta tell me that if you heard this,
if you've heard this far into the podcast.
Um, but one last thing about that,
because I was actually, I think the
thing that I took away from it was
chatting with people outside of my
org, like outside of engineering.
And just once you understand the
work that they're doing, it kind
of gets put into perspective how
important this team culture is.
Sometimes you could think the work
you're doing is the most important thing.
I know you guys are at like a leadership
level, but I think for like, You
know, for the people, you know, that
are still doing IC work, like myself,
sometimes you think the thing you're
doing is the most important thing,
Ps Adam: but it's not,
Arun: but it's not, it takes
every single function to work
properly, um, to get there.
And so, yeah, I think I was just
curious if you guys do the same thing.
We didn't do it intentionally.
It just kind of happened organically.
Um, but like I would like more of that.
I think more people
should do more of that.
Yeah, for sure.
Yeah.
Cool.
So I think we'll wrap it up.
Um, if you haven't, please
subscribe to the hype podcast.
Um, hit that follow, share it.
And, um, great episode guys.
It's good to have you back fellas.
It's good to have you guys back.
Honestly.
Cheers guys.
Cheers.
