Post-Election Breakdown with Special Guest Michelle Stewart
Ps Vance: All right.
Uh, our team told us we're
rolling for the Hype Pod.
Here we go.
Oh my goodness.
The Hype Pod is back.
Post election Hype
Ps Adam: Pod.
I've been here.
I've
been here.
I've
Ps Vance: been here recording.
This is episode 78.
No, I don't know.
When you left it was 32.
We're back.
Yes.
And, uh, just had an election.
Ps Adam: Post election pod.
That's why we have
Ps Vance: our political correspondent.
Ps Adam: Michelle Stewart.
We only get you on for political stuff.
See you in 2028.
She actually does do law as well, folks.
So if you need any legal advice.
No, don't, don't make work for you.
Okay.
Scrap that.
Um, no, let's talk politics.
Cause what a day.
What a day.
Ps Adam: What a day.
What a night.
What A night That was, what A night.
What were you doing last night?
Were you hanging out?
Did you have a watch party?
We had a
Ps Michelle: little watch party.
Wow.
At home.
Um, a couple people over.
Yep.
Uh, mixed.
Mixed group of people.
Oh.
On both sides.
Going for both sides.
A bipartisan party.
Both a bipartisan party on
both sides of the aisle.
Yeah.
Came together to watch.
And so to
Ps Adam: watch the election, was
Ps Michelle: it,
Ps Adam: was it really
Ps Michelle: a
Ps Adam: bipartisan
Ps Michelle: It was
Ps Adam: bipartisan,
Ps Michelle: yeah.
Both sides.
What was
Ps Adam: the mood?
Ps Michelle: At first
it was like, here we go.
Ps Adam: Oh, really?
Ps Michelle: You know?
At what time was this?
At
Ps Adam: what time was it?
Here we go.
Ps Michelle: Six, 6 p.
m.
Ps Adam: So at 6 p.
m.
I believe that Pennsylvania was
still very much in Kamala's favor.
Yep.
Exactly.
Exactly.
It wasn't looking good for Republicans.
It wasn't looking good.
It wasn't.
But then it started to
swing pretty rapidly.
You had the play by play.
I had the play by play.
What were you doing?
Oh, I was, I was half songwriting.
Yes.
Oh,
this is going to be a good album.
With the electoral
Ps Adam: map open.
Yep.
Yep.
Oh,
I can't
Ps Adam: wait to hear that song.
I'd already.
The red is coming.
The blood is changing.
It's, uh, it's, um, it's definitely
a country song from, from that,
but, uh, yeah, no, it was real time.
Cause I already knew, Hey, if you
get Pennsylvania, you pretty much
got an 80 percent chance of winning.
Ps Michelle: Yeah.
Yeah.
Ps Adam: And, uh, and so, uh,
I was like, Oh no, we can't,
we can't lose Pennsylvania.
And then.
Yeah.
Yeah.
When I was watching X all the way home,
um, and, uh, that was Thank God for X.
Why?
Thank God for Elon.
Talk about innovators.
No, it was actually Alex Jones, actually.
I was watching Alex
Jones and, uh, oh, Elon.
Yeah, he bought it.
But, uh, Alex Jones, um, on the way home.
It was entertaining.
Yeah.
Ps Adam: You didn't
Ps Vance: do the all in
real time live commentary?
Ps Adam: No, I didn't.
Um, only because I didn't think
sax was going to be on there.
Okay.
Ps Vance: He, he popped in and out.
He did pop in was partying in Mar a Lago.
Yeah.
I'm sure.
Ps Adam: Yeah.
Ps Vance: Um, yeah.
Yeah.
He was having a good time.
He was slurring towards the end.
But yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I'm sure.
No.
It was more than just Pennsylvania though.
I mean, it was a red wave.
Yeah.
Yeah.
We're talking popular vote.
I think we're
Ps Michelle: still waiting as the film
at the time of this filming for the house
fully, but it looked, it's looking good.
Oh, we're talking Senate majority.
We do.
Oh, do we have the house majority?
Ps Adam: I think we
have the house majority.
About an hour ago, they were still
like, they got the house majority.
Oh, no.
I mean, can we fact check?
Do we have a fact checker?
Katrina, can you just check?
We're saying we.
This is
Ps Vance: not a
Ps Adam: bipartisan podcast.
Do we have the house yet?
Because we've got the Senate.
We've got the popular vote.
We've got the presidency.
We've got more governors.
Do we have the house?
And we could have more.
Um, we could have actually more.
Votes, I think in the supreme court
more more, uh nominees for supreme
court because in the next four years I
think there's about three supreme court
justices that may be up for retirement
retirement Yeah, and it's lifelong.
Ps Michelle: They can
stay as long as they want.
Yeah,
Ps Adam: so you pick
It's still in balance.
What's what's what's in balance give
us give us the update Well, I know that
40 40
Ps Adam: 52
Ps Michelle: No senate, that's the senate
that's the senate right house republic
house would be like force, I think, to
Republicans to a hundred and something.
Ps Adam: Yeah.
Listen, listen to the lawyer go,
we're just going to be pushing
policies for the next four years.
Policies, full send.
This is actually what
Ps Michelle: I'm most excited
about was I said, like, whoever
wins, let it be a landslide.
It has to be right because that's the only
way we move forward as a country If it
was peace right with peace it had like if
it was going to be blue, let it be fully
blue And that's what the people want.
Give them what they want.
Let's see in four years If it's
going to be red, let it be fully red
full red wave
Ps Michelle: so that Because they can then
enact what they're actually going to do.
Otherwise, you're just
gonna it's gonna biden
Ps Vance: got 80 million votes um in 2020
Mm hmm Kamala just got a little over 60.
Where did the 20 million go to Trump?
It's crazy.
I think so.
Isn't that a crazy swing?
That's a
Ps Vance: crazy swing.
Yeah, you're it I feel like the tide
turned honestly talking about Elon.
I feel like when he bought X.
Yeah, I'd started turning
Ps Adam: I actually think,
yes, I think that, I think
there were a few key moments.
I definitely think X was a big, big step,
but I think the assassination attempts.
That was huge.
Assassination.
Like, hey, let's look at where
it went right for Republicans and
where it went wrong for Democrats.
I think where it went right for
Republicans was the fight motto.
Like, Oh, this is serious.
They're really trying to neutralize.
It's the judicial, it's
weaponizing the, the DOJ.
I think it is, uh, the, the attempted
assassinations, proclaiming his Hitler,
everything like that was like, Oh, you
guys are just showing all your cards.
Then I think on the left, I think all
they had, I think they underestimated
America is not, you can't just run
with a kill babies like plan and
America's going to sign up for that.
Hmm.
Because what I'm fascinated by is I'm,
I'm watching social media and obviously
on the day of the election, I just
wanted to make sure everyone knew, Hey,
this is where I'm aligning my vote.
Not, not as the pastor of
I've church as a person.
This is what I am voting values
for these reasons, right?
And at the end of the day, when everyone
who's reacting, Oh no, this is terrible.
I think my question was to be what, what
policies on the left as a Christian.
Were you ignited by it?
Because there's, I see, obviously
there's millions of non Christians who
have voted, uh, for, for Donald Trump,
the Republican party and the policies.
So what are Christians voting for?
That's interesting, huh?
Maybe you could tell me, cause you've
got a lot of friends, family that,
uh, told you they're voting left.
What was the policies
that stood out to them?
Um,
Ps Michelle: I think for them, it's,
uh, a, what people are mourning.
Now is this idea that we've now let
in a new wave of racism misogyny
Ps Adam: Where does that come from?
Ps Michelle: Um They say things
that that trump has actually said
Ps Adam: like what?
Ps Michelle: um At one of his rallies
he brought and i'm still trying to
find it But apparently at one of his
rallies he brought up like an african
american conservative And was like hey,
here's one of the good ones Which is
language that pulls back to back in
the day when the slaves there will be
like good slaves and bad slaves That's
a reach I, I, I'm just, I'm just,
I'm here to just share what this, so
when they hear things like that, or.
Ps Adam: No, see what I'm saying that's a
reach is because what it is, it's actually
nothing Donald Trump has said, it's the
gaslighting of the left that will take
a snippet of something and blow it up.
Like, like they just so obviously did with
his rally at the Madison Square Galley.
See.
Out of Hitler had rallies.
And it's like, Oh, hang on.
Everyone's.
But I
Ps Michelle: mean, during his first
term, he, he, he did definitely say
things that were inflammatory, like
calling, uh, poor black countries as
whole countries and calling, you know,
like there are things he's actually said
out of his mouth that when you watch
In isolation, but we kept saying like,
but he's equal opportunist offender.
Like that's just, he's like, he
doesn't, he's not politically, he's
not PC with how he says things.
And there are certain things like we know,
like, Oh yeah, maybe not say it that way.
Like maybe not, but he's just going
to, but that's just how he truly is.
Like, he's not, if you're Jewish, if
you're black, if you're, if you're
Asian, if you're white, if you're
male, like he's going to come at you.
If you're disabled, like he's
going to come at you with, with
a more direct sort of attack.
And I think that rhetoric they're
saying like, Hey, this is not the
Like even people in Algeria, like
they're saying like now you're
gonna tell your kids that you've now
elected a 34 You can have 34 felonies.
You can grab women by their whatever you
can do these things and that was a crazy
Yeah, like it's not just like it was a
Ps Adam: crazy thing.
No the grabbing the no, no, no, that's
absolutely rubbish Okay, let me just let
me just speak to what that is imagine
that at all times the And like, anybody's
going to hear this and I'm a pastor.
Okay.
There is different rooms that you're
in, where there is like with you, just
saying with your brothers or you with
your, your best friend, and there's
someone there with a little secret
tape recorder and you guys are joking.
Or even if you comment or laugh
at something that may have been
inappropriate in that moment, it's
not, you're being hung out on that
one thing as if that's who you are.
Come on.
Like, we're going to claim that.
Everything on the left, just because it
hasn't been recorded because you weren't
a millionaire and people weren't always
trying to get a gotchu on you that, that
there hasn't been any kind of, uh, dis
uh, reputable thing you've ever said.
Ps Michelle: Right.
Oh, come on.
Right.
Come on.
But these people are
swearing out of the left side
Ps Adam: of their mouth while
they're accusing him out of
the right side of their mouth.
Come on.
But they
Ps Michelle: know how to play the game.
Ps Adam: Right.
Like Kamala's
Ps Michelle: like her whole.
Because she's a
Ps Adam: career politician.
Right.
So
Ps Michelle: that's what I'm saying.
Like he's, he's, he's.
And that's one, that's one thing that's
kind of, you know, breath of fresh air
is you see what you get, but at the
end of the day, we're not, at least I'm
not saying that like everything that
Trump stands for, his, his marriage
record is all these things is like
a model of Christianity and pillar.
And I think they're feeling like
Christians that are supporting him
are amening his entire lifestyle.
So do you think
Ps Adam: that, um, do you
think Trump's a Christian?
Ps Michelle: I don't know.
Ps Adam: See, I don't, I
don't, I'm not sure if he is.
Ps Michelle: I don't know.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Ps Adam: I don't think that that's
where most people vote because he's a
Christian, but his policies line up with
Christian values more than on the left.
Yeah.
So I'm just trying to
find like, yeah, sure.
Okay.
Be upset with the person, but
you're voting for an America
that you want to live in.
What they're saying though is
Ps Michelle: you're trusting that this
person now is going to like, he's saying
one thing, but how do you know when
he gets there, he's going to do it.
Ps Adam: Okay.
Well, you already know what
the, what the other party were
saying they're going to do.
Yeah.
Cool.
We know they're going to do that because
they said they're going to do that.
Yeah.
So versus, is he going to do
what he says rather than she's
definitely going to do what she said?
Ps Michelle: Yeah, exactly.
Ps Adam: Like we're going to open
up abortions and we're going to,
you know, like seriously, like
I think it's, I'm just confused
Ps Michelle: about what,
well, she also did a campaign.
That was really good.
I'm here for the middle.
I'm here for the, for the person Trump
could never relate because the whole
thing was like, even when Obama came up
to chastise black men, she's like, well,
she grew up like you like she knows you.
She, she understands your
struggles like vote for her.
Right.
And this, this whole thing of
like, I can relate because I, I'm,
I'm just like you, I, I didn't
grow up like a billion, you know?
And so I think that, that there is some,
you know, You know, like, well, now you
have this old white guy who's got billions
of dollars that's going to give, you know,
tariffs that's going to help us, right?
Um, and cut down all the social welfare
programs and cut down on education
is going to gut all the soul and the
heart of what makes our country kind.
Yeah, I think at the
Ps Adam: fundamental, what we've
got is a two scenarios here.
If I'm looking for financial advice.
I'm not going for some to
someone in my situation.
Like that sounds ridiculous, right?
If I want financial advice, do I go
to someone who's been in my situation?
Who's still in my situation?
Or do I want someone who
isn't in my situation?
Who is the business savvy in a sense
to give me insights to help me get out.
Ps Michelle: Yep.
But that's, that's,
that's the thing though.
I think is in America, what we have is.
a country that has not
defined the problem well.
So you have some people that think
the problem is racism, prejudice,
and that's what we're trying to do.
And then you've got some people
that think the problem is people
can't put food on their tables.
And what we saw last night was
overwhelmingly the left and the
mainstream media underestimated
what people think the problem is.
Yes.
And they thought the problem was Oh, we
really care about social justice issues.
People will tell you they care.
Yeah, so that's what
Ps Adam: I'm saying.
Like, I can get it.
A lot of non Christians on the
left, they would vote that way.
Where, where it gets confusing
is as Christians, as Christ
followers, where, where did you go?
Hey, man, that left
narrative appealed to me.
Ps Michelle: Because they don't
see the abortion as a definitive,
I have to agree with abortion.
What they presented on the
left was we're just pro choice.
We're saying, And so for a lot
of Christians, they're saying, I
wouldn't make that choice myself,
but I don't think the government is
the right, uh, institution to say to
someone, you have to make this choice.
And so when they're voting for
the left, they're not thinking
they're voting for abortion.
They don't, they're not thinking
they're voting for, you know, they're
saying like, no, we want abortion.
People to have
Ps Adam: I'm just I'm just
yeah, I just think it's such a
lame excuse I think people that
Ps Vance: vote on principle are
gonna probably stay in their voting
pattern for a really long time
It's gonna be really hard to sway
somebody that's voting on principle.
I still think in this election Um,
that those that swung or go back
and forth actually still vote on
sentiment, still vote on tone.
Actually, what I saw that it was
drastically different from 2016,
2020 in terms of Trump is the tone
around Trump has completely shifted.
Yeah, we went from that.
You know, grab women parts conversation.
And we went from the clips that yes, a
lot of clips, um, were gas lit, right?
To long form podcast content where,
and I agree, like you shouldn't ping
somebody on one moment, but if you
can put somebody in a three hour
podcast, you can make a more informed.
Yeah.
About that person.
Right.
And I found that it was a more
balanced perspective this time around.
And I feel like a lot of people completely
shifted their tone and their sentiment.
And they like in 2020 if you voted
for Trump, nobody was saying you
voted for Trump in 2016 even.
Right.
But people are like so much
more proud because there's so
much more positive sentiment.
It's not.
Obviously 100 percent positive
symptom, but it's more than it's ever
been in eight years, in my opinion.
Ps Michelle: But there's definitely
groups of people though, that see a
vote for Trump is a vote for racism,
misogyny, transphobia, homophobia, but
Ps Vance: then you found that that's
not the majority, but that's not
Ps Adam: the majority.
Ps Vance: That's,
Ps Michelle: that's what,
that's what, that's what
Ps Adam: I'm speaking to Christians here.
I'm not speaking to non
christians just for a moment.
If you're a christian, just listen to
me in in you somewhere lost in your
despondence now the truth of the matter
is this is What we have with this
presidency and I think why we saw such
a red wave and I I don't know why it's
confusing to Christians who voted blue
what you missed is you got caught up in
a whole narrative of lies Gaslighting
that you were projected to I feel like
this is your wake up moment You And I'm
saying that with all the kindness in my
heart, wake up, you've, you've literally
got caught into a sleep in a slumber
where you have had your, such a narrow
window to what you believe that you got
caught up with a whole bunch of lies.
The truth of the matter is we
saw four years under Trump.
We saw four years under Biden, Harris, and
we're like the popular vote of America.
The majority of Americans, Christians and
non Christians said, not doing that again.
Yeah.
Ps Adam: We're going to go with this.
And to be amongst those who were
in the minority as Christians
voting is very confusing to me.
Mm.
How that you could be caught up and miss
so much of what most of America saw.
That's what, that's what I find confusing.
Ps Michelle: Yeah.
No, I'm, I'm, I'm with you.
I think, yeah.
I think though, now looking at it.
Even how people voted you definitely,
uh, a challenge to keep on with that
racism narrative because that's why
I was like, yeah, that's why I was
like, it needs to be a decisive.
So it can be like, not everyone
in America can be racist.
Like at some point you've got to
be like, to your point, wake up
and be like, cause a lot of people
are saying, I don't understand.
When's the wake
Ps Adam: up moment?
This should be it is what I'm trying
to appeal to and hope to that.
This is that wake up moment.
Let's lose the racist narrative.
Can we just let that go for a moment?
They've, if that's the last nail
thread that you're holding onto,
you've got to be like, maybe I'm wrong.
That's that's wisdom is to ask.
Maybe I'm wrong.
Ps Michelle: Hopefully.
I don't know.
I think people are, they're just
going to turn on each other.
I think Latino men, you let
us down as people of color.
And it's like, well.
But
Ps Adam: I thought you
brought up a good point.
Let let's, let's get off that train
for a second, because I feel like a
good point was is the way that, uh,
campaigning is done have to change.
I think it was 15 billion, 15 billion
was spent on campaigning where they
say that the influence didn't come from
the ads, the campaigns that came from
the podcasts, that is a free version.
of communities that have been built.
Ps Vance: Democrats raised, I
think, almost twice as much money.
Yeah.
We can fact check that, but they
raised way more money than Republicans.
So it's interesting, huh?
And obviously, in terms of long form
podcasts, Trump worked way harder.
He showed up to way more meetings.
A really influential podcast, obviously
the climax being Joe Rogan, right?
Which is the most listened
to podcast in the world.
And I just think that if you listen
to somebody for three hours, you'll
have a more definitive, okay, I really
don't like him or he's actually okay.
Or I actually like him.
You can't determine that on clips
that are in your algorithm trying to
convince you one thing, you know, um,
and that's what's happened in 2016.
That's what definitely happened in 2020.
I felt like it was more balanced to me.
I felt like there was this undercurrent
in the last four years where most
reasonable people I talked to would agree
that, man, this plan that we signed up
for for 2020 that most people elected.
It's really not working out
that well, like we're in wars.
Like inflation is crazy.
Definitely.
Like I can't afford as much things
as I used to be able to afford.
Um, the cultural narrative just got crazy.
Like it really did.
Uh, men and women boxing and you
know, all that type of stuff.
Like there was just this fatigue
of like, This is crazy town.
Like we've actually gotten into
like pandemic was crazy, but this
is post pandemic is crazy town.
And I think that the long form podcast
allowed people to actually talk that out
and have permission to have a platform
to talk that out and actually identify,
Oh, there's more people like me.
Right.
And so I would have actually been very
skeptical, like super, I was already
skeptical going into the election.
Yeah.
Ps Vance: I would have been so skeptical
if Trump lost, to be honest, because
the sentiment I was sensing was that,
oh wow, like this is not even just in
the undercurrent conversations anymore.
Yeah.
This has made it mainstream because
in my opinion, podcast is mainstream.
Ps Michelle: Yeah.
But don't you think people listen to who,
like who they are already leaning towards?
So that was my curiosity.
Ps Vance: I was like, am I in a bubble?
Or am I actually hearing
what the majority might be?
That's what I was interested in.
I was like, maybe I'm in a bubble cause I
feel like this is going to be a landslide.
Yeah,
Ps Adam: no, no.
And that's my point.
So, so I don't want to keep going
back to this point, but the wake up
moment has to be, have I just, Have
I just echo chambered myself into a
world of people reinforcing a belief
that is actually built on a lie.
But because I'm getting reinforced from
every angle, I'm now shook as a Christian
who voted this way and I, I wasn't
with the popular votes and I wouldn't.
So now it's like really shook them
to the core, but had they actually
taken time or now from now, just.
Instead of being upset and mad and,
you know, America's going to hell or
whatever they're saying, what if this is
actually, you could just lay down your
animosity just for a moment and go, Hey,
could I actually have gotten it wrong?
Ps Michelle: Yeah.
Ps Adam: So now's an opportunity to,
Ps Michelle: my perspective, I
Ps Adam: could have, my, I've
got, well, one, my vote wrong.
Uh,
I
Ps Adam: got my perspective wrong,
or I believed people who were wrong.
Yeah, they, yeah, that's, yeah,
Ps Adam: it's all wrong because
it didn't, it's not right in the
sense that that isn't what the
majority of Americans wanted.
Yeah.
And that's what's been emphatically
clear with this election is it
was kind of like a steamroll.
Yeah.
I mean, Trump won ground in areas
that have been blue for 10 years.
Like that's crazy.
This was like
probably one of the
most decisive victories.
Ps Adam: It's probably the best, biggest,
like, political comeback in history.
Yeah, that's crazy.
Like, that's wild.
The swing of where Trump was.
January 6th to this.
Can we talk about this too?
That's crazy.
You remember last election cycle, all
the Christians that were prophesying two
term president, and then They apologized.
Yes, but they were right.
Studied.
They were right.
Ps Vance: Chris Ballin come in the pot
They were, they were.
Now come in the pot now.
And I now remember, honestly, I remember
Ps Michelle: mocking them, being like,
well look, where's your prophet voice now?
You've come a long way.
I have come a long way.
Ps Adam: Yes.
Because how does it feel
to vote Republican finally?
Ps Michelle: Um, I've
voted Republican before.
Have you?
I have, I have.
Um, I think this time though, what was.
It was easy this time though, because
to, to, to the points of what you said,
the moment you actually enter, not even
listen, but interact with a community
that is, um, no, I don't say normal,
but just not so swayed one emotionally
charged because when you're in, so
coming out of college, right, you,
you literally are surrounded for four
years of people that think like you,
the professors are pushing you in a
direction and radicalized to grad school.
Like you're in.
You're in such an intellectual bubble.
So then you go and you sort of then
find people when you come out of those
institutions that are similar to you.
Sure.
So then when you come, but once
you actually interact with everyday
Americans, it's, and, and you listen
to, you talk to people that, that's
the thing I never understood, honestly.
It's like, For someone who voted
Kamala, I'm not, I'm not impeding
on you an entire value system.
I'm like, I want to get to know
and understand, and I found
that a lot more on the right.
Yeah.
Like people willing to just
at least have conversations.
And even within the Republican party,
I find there's more dialogue of ideas.
Yeah.
There's like, you've got Vivek,
you've got like, even when I listen
to the podcast, it's really diverse.
Yeah.
It's a, it's diversity of thought.
Of thought.
Yeah.
On the left.
It's like, literally, if you don't
think this way and follow this
line, you have no place in this pot.
Like, cause I know some people
that are like, man, maybe I
could be a conservative Democrat.
And I'm like, Oh, I can see
you'd be a liberal Republican,
Ps Adam: because
Ps Michelle: there's no
space for that in that.
Ps Adam: And I think what I've seen,
and even talking to, you know, some
of our producers that set this pot up,
they've noticed when they post their Uh,
something contrary to that, that it's an
Ps Michelle: unfollow, it's
Ps Adam: not even, I'm reinforcing my
echo chamber by eliminating anybody that
thinks differently because I can't handle
following somebody who thinks differently.
So all you do is reinforce your little
echo chamber and now you are bewildered
as to how did we lose the vote?
Yeah.
Ps Adam: Well, cause your world was so
curated for cancelling any other voice or
opinion, instead of being open to maybe
a contrary thought, I just, I just can't
handle that because it doesn't hold water.
Ps Michelle: Yeah.
Ps Adam: If it held water, you would
be able to have a conversation, but
if you're, if your whole policies
and that don't hold water, you're not
gonna be able to have a conversation.
I think with, with that though,
Let's um, maybe we could look, not in
the past, let's look in the future.
Yeah.
Ps Adam: Because I'm excited.
If this, if this means Senate, and if
it means House, uh, Republic, if we
have the, if the Republicans take the
House, if Republicans have already
taken the Senate, and we've got
the President, what does this mean?
What does this mean?
We can
Ps Vance: see or expect in your opinion.
I think a lot.
I mean, there's a lot of possibility.
My question though, for you pastor
Adam, as we dive into that is how
much do you think God wants to use
politics to bring redemption in society?
Ps Adam: I really do rest on, we
had a town hall, uh, just a week
before the election, just to bring
leaders together in our community.
And this was kind of like the tone is.
If the Bible makes it very clear, there
is no leader that's ever appointed without
God's authority, both whether Biden
or, you know, Obama or Trump or Stalin.
Wow.
That it is God allowing something.
And sometimes you've got to just rest that
God has a bigger plan of maybe revealing
a season of persecution to bring people
back to him or a season of blessing that
you don't, you, you gotta, you gotta trust
under the sovereignty of God, that God
has a bigger plan than what I'm seeing.
And I think that what, what we're
seeing right now is, uh, you know, What
we get to do is we get to do our best
to actually steer it towards values
because For me when I think about
godly values, I'm thinking about life.
That's right at the primary Yeah,
like how many pro life how many
children are now gonna potentially be
saved as a result of his presidency?
Yeah Like there's so many things that
I think just because murder is illegal
When it comes down to what do we want
our government to do first and foremost?
Law, murder has to be outlawed.
Do you,
Ps Michelle: do you don't think
though that's, cause what Trump
has really done is just get, got
the decisions back to the state.
Um, and we saw Florida, Floridians,
shout out to Floridians.
They said, no, we're good.
Um, but majority, anytime abortion
has been on a state ballot,
it's essentially voted for.
So you, you don't feel
like as much as Trump.
You know on the federal level you don't
think this might have like a backlash.
So for example, California Oh, yeah.
No, they're gonna be like sure
Ps Adam: for sure.
We're gonna have all the still the
liberal governors who are going to Give
permission for abortions, but at least
it's not a national permission Yeah,
that was Kamala's Mo was we're gonna
make this a national permission every
like legalize it nationally and it was
going to be Enforced and entrenched in
history never to be able to be changed
Okay, and so at least we have saved what
if it's like 13, 15 states, 50 states,
20 states, whatever, however many states,
every state that bans abortion is another
millions and millions and millions of
children that are saved in my opinion.
Ps Vance: Yeah.
I don't know if Trump's a Christian.
What I'm encouraged by, it seems like
he was a lot more open, um, in inviting
pastors and listening to pastors.
I think it's on pastors now
that have his ear to hold him
accountable to what he said.
You know, to hold his administration,
administration accountable to as many
of those Christian values as possible.
Even pushing the boundary a
bit more on pro life, right?
Even pushing the boundary more on
some of these other policies that
Christians should be caring about.
You know, I was really, uh,
impacted a few weeks ago.
I got to spend time in DC.
We had a, uh, spiritual heritage
tour, um, in the Capitol building.
And it was like this crazy situation
where one of the Christian, uh, house
representatives was in town and allowed
us to get into the house chamber.
Like we couldn't take any phones or
anything like that in there, but we got in
there and we got to hear from his heart.
And he was telling us about
in the house chamber, right?
You have all the iconic judges.
In American history and actually
in world history, um, basically
surrounding the room, right?
There's like a picture of them
kind of like a monument, but
they're all facing away from the
room like their profile, right?
But there's one that's facing over
the room directly over the room and
it's moses And Moses is facing on
the back over the room and it's a
big sign in the front of the room.
You've seen Pelosi there.
You've seen a lot of people there, right?
Um, it says in God we trust.
Yeah.
Like,
Ps Vance: like if people don't think
this is a Christian nation, this is
absolutely founded as a Christian nation.
And there's still very much a lot of.
people that are preserving it, trying
to preserve it as a Christian nation.
And so it just kind of, um, reminded
me that, okay, the founding fathers,
they were even telling us this story.
And I want to study it more where if
you actually look at the declaration of
independence and you compare it to some of
the sermons that were written and preached
in that day, the language in the sermons
that was preached before the writing of
the direct declaration of independence,
those statements and those sermons are
found in the declaration of independence.
And so pastors actually had an
influence on the founding fathers
and how they declared and decreed
how this country should run and the
values that it should stand for.
And it just got me thinking, okay.
You know, um, I don't know exactly
what the perspective was about
Rome in Jesus's day and how much
it would be redeemed in that time.
But it's very clear that America has a
lot more Christian principles embedded
in its foundation than Rome did, right?
We've made progress in that regard.
And I'm just like, how much does
God have for us in the next four
years to bring more redemptive
Ps Adam: value?
And I think for me as a Christian, right?
So.
I get to vote.
My, my main objective is to
save people, see people saved.
One to Jesus discipled.
Okay.
Do I want to save people from wars
and save people to the kingdom?
Or do I just want the peace of
not having wars so I can focus
on saving them in the kingdom?
Right.
Or is there two kinds
of saving we have to do?
We have to save their normal human,
everyday life and their eternity.
Or is it just, Hey, I'm
At least they get to live.
Let's now on earth, let's save
them for eternity as well.
And so I think that you get to create the
world by a vote that lines up with life.
And I think economic policies
and all those kinds of things.
I think it's interesting.
I don't know if you saw this
today, but, uh, stock market.
Oh, it's ripping.
Oh my gosh.
Uh, Bitcoin reached a new high.
I know all my crypto bros, uh, quietly
rejoicing, even though they can't
publicly in their woke workplaces, but
they are quietly celebrating 16 Z's
full send, but yeah, everybody else.
No, no, no.
I think there's still, I think
there's still some, you know, work
bros in the, in the crypto world.
But that for me is like interesting how.
Is what does that mean?
What does that mean from
an economic point of view?
The sentiment, whether people, uh, public
about it or not, but there's so much
belief because the stock market talks.
Ps Vance: Yeah.
And you know, when it was definitive
that Trump won, I think it started
ripping because the stock market is
mainly driven by perception, right?
So actual events that happen, it
gets priced in pretty quickly.
And so if there is big pops,
it's just perception, right?
And I think the perception is able to
justify itself because at least Trump
was clearer about his economic policies.
And so the market loves clarity.
Yeah.
Yes, the market hates uncertainty
when there's uncertainty,
it'll dip, it'll dive.
Right.
Um, but if you can create clarity of
what's the plan, what are we going to do?
So it reveals confidence.
Yeah.
There's, there's hype, right?
Yeah.
Um, there's a positive optimism.
That's why I woke up this morning and
I don't have, uh, I haven't really
been on Instagram, but I don't have.
I guess an echo chamber that's super
depressed and bummed right now, but
I do, uh, open up my stock market
up and see that everything's up.
I'm like, man, this is a rosy day.
This is a, this is a green day.
This is incredible where I think, you
know, where there's going to have to be
a reconstruction if the Democrats want to
come back in any sort of meaningful way.
Is there going to have to realize, okay,
at least on economics, we've got to get
a lot more clear because there was even
just questioning Kamala had said once,
and she's trying to retract it where
she's going to tax unrealized gains,
capital gains, which is just crazy.
So it's like all that uncertainty is
just not great for the stock market.
Right.
Yeah.
Ps Michelle: Now I'm hoping like,
honestly, over the, over the next
two years, I'm going to give him
at least two years to deliver.
Because I think that's nice of you.
I think two years, I think we get
two years to deliver because I do
think right now we're sensing, uh,
Ps Adam: uh, president Trump, if you know,
Michelle has given you two years studying
who's running the country right now.
We don't know now
Ps Michelle: because no
one's running it now.
Um, so, but I'm saying that to
say, to continue, cause I mean,
realistically Trump can't fix everything
that's wrong right now, right?
Like it, it's been, no, they forecast
it's going to take at least eight years.
Exactly.
And so, and he's only
got one more term to pick
Ps Adam: up.
Ps Michelle: You think
it's going to be JD next?
Ps Adam: That would be
the natural incumbent,
Ps Vance: wouldn't it?
Ps Michelle: No, not necessarily.
Ps Vance: Yeah.
I mean, he's, he's coming
off pretty strong right now.
He started off rocky.
I mean, if
Ps Adam: like, cause he's got
one more term left, right?
So you've got to forecast that
halfway through the term, if he
can start to steer it, it would be
giving JD more experience in their,
you know, having a handle, building
a reputation, which Kamala didn't.
Yeah.
Ps Adam: So as a vp, what's
his reputation gonna be?
Because Yeah, biggest question was
what was her greatest achievement
or what was any achievement?
Yeah.
And so that if the Republicans
learn from that is what she said.
Yeah.
If, if , if, uh, if the Republicans are
smart, they will halfway through, start
giving JD a little bit more leadership.
Yeah.
To build a resume, right.
So that he could be a natural choice of,
hey, that's, there's already experience.
Yeah.
There's resume, there's reputation,
there's already no notoriety.
Youth, all that kind of stuff.
Youth without the volatility of
youth, youth with experience.
That's that's the key, that double theme.
But what I do want to maybe ask about
is, could we ever trust polls again?
Ps Vance: No.
Oh man, that's actually a good point.
So rubbish.
Ridiculous.
They had Kamala leading.
Leading.
Ps Adam: But the betting poly
market was convincingly Trump.
So that's why it was such a confusion.
You got the silver bullet.
You've got all these polls.
They're scams and and donald
trump said it on the joe rogan.
It's a massive scam Well, he said it he
said, uh, I just don't I just don't trust
the polls because they're scam artists
they just Who's ever been asked by a
poll like who's ever had a phone call?
And everyone you talk to no
one's ever had a phone call.
Yeah, so how they've got no
account of who are they polling?
Well, even last night all
Ps Vance: the mainstream media mainstream
media is just I mean X is propaganda
to an extent but like mainstream
media is so blatantly propaganda.
Yeah, but even last night
Trump is clearly going to win.
It's like, Oh, we're still tallying.
Ps Adam: I think Rachel, Rachel Maddow
was crying at one point and it was
like, man, Rachie, that was bad.
Um, but I think it's like,
it's interesting, right?
Like the, what?
Do we move away?
I'm coming back to, you know, the
podcast format of campaigning.
Okay.
We're spending billions
of dollars on campaign.
Should there be a limit to
what a campaign can spend?
Because where are we asking?
Where could that money be better spent?
Oh my gosh.
Okay.
Yeah.
Uh, 15 billion.
Yes.
Yes.
And when
Ps Vance: you But it's making a lot
of our tech bro friends more rich.
But if
Ps Michelle: you think about it, we
had only one presidential debate.
Yeah.
Ps Vance: One.
Crazy.
Ps Michelle: Cause to your point,
I think it is like back in the day,
you would have them actually go at
it and present both their visions.
You can actually have a lot of debate.
Unbiased, not that you have three,
three versus one, you know, you
actually have unbiased, like
they will be asking questions.
You'd have town halls.
Exactly.
Yeah.
Ps Adam: And I like the all
in Joe Rogan podcast style.
So helpful.
You can sit down for a three hour
conversation here, not just even their
policies, but just how they talk.
What's their values?
What do they see and talk?
And if you could hear both sides
in the same format, I think
people just didn't hear from.
Ps Vance: Yeah, she didn't show up on any,
Ps Adam: yeah, and, and sure.
And that, that was the revealer
that there was no, um, beyond a
script, it couldn't actually sustain.
So, okay, cool.
You missed out.
So what I'm wondering is if we get rid
of polls, we put a limit on how much you
can, you know, spend on your campaign.
And just go to the free versions of,
you know, established podcasts that
Ps Vance: maybe I think it's, I think
it's a way to get on the high pod.
Yeah.
Have a welcome.
We would welcome any presidential.
Yeah.
We,
we, we,
Ps Vance: we, we called Kamala.
She didn't want to show up.
That's what everybody's saying.
It's like their favorite line.
Yeah.
We called her.
I don't know if they've
actually called her.
We extend the same opportunity.
If you're listening, we're extending.
Did you guys, uh, see the
acceptance speech that Trump did?
Oh yeah.
I stayed up for it.
One thing stood out to you.
One thing that I gathered was that I'm
like, this guy probably is one of the
best dinner party hosts of all time.
He, I was like, wow, you have.
You have politicians, you got
Dana White, you have the U.
S.
Open champion.
Where is he?
Where is he?
Get out!
Get out!
Ps Vance: This, this, this man would
be so good in the Hype Network.
Like he's just like such a mix.
He did what he did.
In that setting, I know, you know,
again, last eight years for the most
part tone has been really bad But you
saw him give that acceptance speech and
I don't know if you can look at that
pragmatically and be like he's not likable
Like he's just like yeah, i'm like dude.
This guy is like was probably like Class
president in high school or something.
He probably like, you
know, throws a good dinner.
Like, you know what I mean?
He throws a good barbecue.
Yeah, I agree.
Ps Adam: What stood out to you
from the acceptance speech?
Ps Michelle: Um, less what he
was saying and more his family.
His family.
Yeah, his family.
His family.
I think it hit me for the first time.
Like not being a parent.
You had all your kids and
they're adult to Barron Barron
Ps Adam: is a giant what
Ps Michelle: what in
Ps Adam: the world?
I
Ps Michelle: think he's six seven.
Ps Adam: Yeah Kim's
Fact check how tall is
Barron Trump for us Katrina?
He's
Ps Michelle: powered
over Trump and Melania.
I was like, oh my gosh He's
Ps Adam: he is a giant.
Ps Michelle: I but
Ps Adam: but I agree.
Yeah, the family are there Yeah in the
family are buried the fam like Come on,
the family when you're not, I think, well,
he's six, nine, nine, he's almost seven
foot because Trump's Trump's a big man.
He's getting close.
He's getting up there.
Wow.
No, he looked, he looked gigantic.
He's 18.
So it's nine.
So crazy.
What you've, what you've got there is
I think what we saw with Tim Waltz and
Kamala, like it was like, and Biden
broken family, disjointed family.
Transgender family, all these
like twisted kind of backgrounded
family, but at least with Trump,
you've got, Hey, they're all there.
They all love each other.
He called out all his
children and their spouses.
He spoke about his, his in laws
and it was, he gave honor to his
wife's mother who passed away.
So she's a remarkable woman.
Like You didn't need to do any of that.
Nope.
Yeah.
Ps Adam: Doesn't even
have he a script for that.
He did.
No, they down.
Did you see?
They took down the teleprompter.
They took down the teleprompter.
He just freewheeling
Ps Michelle: at 3:00 AM Yeah.
As a 70 something old man.
Like I, yeah, that's I think the most You
legendary.
Yeah.
We at Dana.
Dana's a great guy.
Yeah.
Words.
How about Susie?
They didn't wanna talk.
Susie, did you see that?
Susie Su, she was like, really didn't
wanna talkie and Chris Susie freaked out.
Susie and Chris.
That's a big stage.
Ps Michelle: Well, but his
wherewithal to be like, Susie, you
know how we were saying, this is
the greatest, I've never seen you
Ps Vance: like nervous
Ps Michelle: like this.
But Susie and Chris, the
greatest political comeback.
We need to study them.
She's the reason, goodness.
I was like, oh finally we can
see who's behind this thing.
So we see that we see him.
But it's Susie being like, go on this
podcast, do this, be this per like,
and, and so she's like, well, he
Ps Adam: credited Barron
for the Joe Rogan podcast.
Oh, did he?
Wow.
Yeah.
He said that, you know, Barron's
telling me who's, who's who I
need to speak to, and he said,
you need to go on Joe Rogan dad.
And so go Barron.
But that's cool, isn't it?
Like, I mean, he's a 7-year-old father.
What's Barron?
18 years old.
18.
Yeah.
Ps Adam: Lean into that.
Yeah.
Like, if you're thinking that you've got a
president out of touch, well, guess what?
He's got a son who's a Gen Z er.
That's a good point.
Yeah.
So you're not going to get a
leader who's got more invested
interest in that generation.
That's a good point.
Ps Vance: Trump is a paradox, huh?
Because as much as it's perceived
that all he does is tear people
down in that setting, I felt like
he had like a gift of encouragement.
I was like, Oh my gosh, like, Whoa,
like, and, and you know, you know, what's
interesting is that, um, In other settings
that I've seen him speak about his kids.
Again, I don't know if he's a Christian,
but one thing that had been admirable
that he says consistently all the
time, they're like, you know, how do
you kind of keep your family intact?
For the most part, your kids are great.
And things like that.
He's like, I just tell them don't smoke.
Don't drink.
Don't smoke.
It's like, uh, oversimplistic,
but kind of powerful guidance.
I'm like, wow.
He's like, I've never smoked.
I've never drank in my life.
And he's just like, I
just know too many people.
It just becomes a problem.
And it, but it's like, it seems
so simple, but it's like powerful.
Ps Michelle: Was Tiffany there?
Ps Vance: I don't know.
I'm not sure.
Ps Adam: I don't know.
Fact checker.
Man, we're making the fact checker work.
I feel like
Ps Michelle: maybe not all
his children were there.
Was one missing?
Ps Adam: I don't, I don't, I can't
admit that I know all the Trump kids.
No, no, I know them.
You don't?
I recently, uh, saw Laura.
You know them all?
They're in there.
I don't know.
You don't?
Is that weird that I don't?
Yes!
I don't think that's weird.
You should.
I don't think it's weird that we don't,
Ps Michelle: but you voted
for this, but you dunno.
His kids,
Ps Adam: I didn't vote for his family.
I voted for him.
, like I voted for JD and,
and him, you know, little
Ps Michelle: Vivek, you know, the
sweet ve come, I voted, voted for
Ps Adam: policies, actually,
to be honest with you.
That's true.
That is true.
I didn't really, that is true
necessarily even vote for the president.
I voted for the policies
that I believe in.
Uh, yeah, that proves it right
there,
.
Ps Adam: Um, but I think there was,
uh, I'm excited to see what this means.
Yeah.
I really am, you know,
to, to not just have.
A, uh, Donald Trump in presidency,
but to see the Senate, the House
Republicans, and the team around him.
R.
F.
K.
Tulsi Gabbard.
So make America healthy again.
Vivek, you've got Elon.
Is he going to get a role though?
I feel like Vivek is always
kind of in the outskirts.
I think he'll get a role.
I think he'll be like a, some, either
transport minister or something.
He'll be, he'll be something.
He'll get something.
Come on, he's going to get a,
he's going to get a toe in.
Alright, he's definitely
going to get a toe in.
Ps Vance: He didn't get an encouragement.
He didn't get a shout out.
I felt bad for him.
I was like, he works so hard.
Tulsi didn't get a shout
out either.
Yeah, that's true.
Ps Michelle: True.
They did RFK actually.
No, no, RFK got a big shout out.
He's like, just leave me my
oil, just leave me my oil.
I said, you can do anything else
you want, but don't touch my oil.
Ps Adam: And, um, but
Vivek was on the front row.
So he was down on the front row.
Okay.
Uh, Elon wasn't on stage either.
But he
Ps Vance: talked about
Elon for like 10 minutes.
He did.
The way he tells stories is so funny.
He talked about this rocket in such a
weird way for like 2 and a half minutes.
And the arms came around
it and gave it a hug.
And then he goes, it was really
good looking when it was lifted.
But then it got really ugly.
Who was the guy he put
on hold for 45 minutes?
Ps Michelle: Did you catch that?
He was like, this is the most
powerful guy in politics, but I
had him on hold for 45 minutes.
What a flex.
No, Trump just loves to flex.
I don't even think it was anybody.
Yeah, it's just.
He loves the flex.
No, but who's more powerful
than the President?
Exactly.
. That's
Ps Adam: what he said.
One of one of the books.
Yeah.
.
But
Ps Adam: um, yeah, I think that
there is a, uh, I think that what,
what Vivek will do, I think he
could do a number of good things.
Yeah.
Um, I think the, what is it, the Doge.
The department of, uh,
something efficiency.
Oh, government efficiency.
Ps Vance: Isn't it?
Isn't that the one?
Or is it?
Yeah.
That's the one
Ps Adam: is a genius.
I'm really excited about genius.
I mean, his acronyms are amazing.
He's using doge coin.
He's so clever.
He's like plan this all out for a decade.
He's dominating.
Ps Adam: He's playing chess with
robotic, um, um, So, yeah, but I
think that that's going to be fun to
watch it, you know, I think it's one
fun to watch, but two, it's essential
Ps Vance: for our economy.
Ps Adam: Yeah.
Ps Vance: Okay, so you're a pastor that
obviously pastors a church right in
the heart of the Silicon Valley, right?
And so we don't know exactly the
stats, but let's just say that
our church is split in the middle.
In terms of red and blue, what,
what's your approach, right?
Like what's your approach of, I
don't know what the, I'm just,
you know, hypothetical, but like,
what's your approach to how you
pastor a congregation like that?
Cause not every congregation
is like that in America, right?
Yeah.
Ps Adam: They're either
all red or all blue.
Ps Vance: Oh, for sure.
Yeah.
Ps Adam: Yeah.
So I've got my, my standard
policy is there are platforms I
can speak about politics on that
shouldn't be the Sunday platform.
I don't want to, you know,
Adulterate my Sunday platform.
I want it to be about Jesus.
I want it to be about biblical things.
I want to be about stewardship.
I want to be a disciple.
Well, this
Ps Vance: past Sunday, you even
said people are more passionate
about Trump than Jesus,
Ps Adam: which I'm like, come on,
like let's, let's prioritize Jesus.
Yeah.
Um, but then I want to create town halls.
I want to create leaders
meetings of podcasts.
It's different platforms where as
a human being, uh, I can actually
share my convictions as a real, just
realizing that regardless of what people
think, I am a leader in a community.
And so there is a responsibility for
people who are in the community that
I've, I've built and, and developed for
them to know what do I think, whether
they want to follow or not, that's
up to them, but at least what does
the leader of this community think?
And so that's why I want
to put it out there.
Now, Um, what I want to do in a way,
whereas I'm open to conversation
because something that I do, I
don't do things without conviction.
I'm very convicted on
every decision that I make.
I think long and hard about it.
And I know a lot of people don't
think much about their decisions.
They just follow.
Yeah.
But as a leader of a community, you don't
get to follow, you have to be a leader.
So you have to think through everything.
So I'm always open to.
Uh, helping people see why
I see what I, what I think.
Um, but, but loving people
in their decision regardless.
So I think that.
The way i'm pastoring our church
in this season is i'm hoping that I
can illuminate some things to people
Yeah, it's not going to be me that
determines that it's going to be them
Yeah,
Ps Adam: whether they just shut out
close i'm not following pastor anymore or
whatever, you know So yeah, i've already
got a couple of conversations booked
up with people in some of our campuses.
Good.
Um, and uh, We're gonna see see what it
Ps Vance: leads to hopefully fruit
How does that go when obviously
the the iron sharpens iron,
you know process do you feel?
You And I know it is mostly on them
if they want to be influenced or
not, but do you feel like there are
certain approaches, tactics that
you've found successful in positive
influencing or even the other way around?
Have you been illuminated to some
things that have helped kind of
even shape some of your thoughts?
Oh, for sure.
Yeah.
I mean, obviously I'm under a
Ps Adam: pastor as well.
Yeah.
Good.
Who has challenged the way I've
thought about stuff before.
Um, and you know, I think when, when,
you know, I, I've realized that I've kind
of, Even in seasons past probably been a
little bit too one dimensionally ignorant
to the bigger picture Wow, and when I'm
in a conversation with my pastor, he's
been able to unpack much deeper levels
of what this means on him on a Historical
setting and a future setting and even a
spiritual setting that beautiful for me.
I'm like, wow I can't deny that like that
that now That builds a deeper conviction.
So that's what I want to do is I
want to kind of get people off the
facade of what it looks like on
the surface to maybe dig in a bit
deeper to what it means spiritually.
Beautiful.
Uh, strongholds, the demonic.
We believe in the demonic.
We believe that there is a demonic
force that wants to move through things.
And the balance is how do I not
over spiritualize it, but how
do I not under spiritualize it?
Yeah, that's good.
Because they're both in play, uh, and,
and I think it's at the same time, my,
my hope is to educate and challenge.
And my goal is not even
to convince people.
Cause I want them to build a conviction
of what they are convinced of themselves.
Ps Vance: Yeah.
It's probably the enemy's plan that we
all just keep saying surface level things.
Yep.
Right.
That's probably the enemy's plan.
It's distraction.
Um, is to stay in the facade.
Ps Adam: And this is where I get
frustrated with the gaslighting
of racism and that kind of stuff,
because it's a distraction.
It's a distraction.
You're getting blinded.
You're literally got narrow tunnel vision.
You're, you're just going
to hang everything on that.
But hang on.
Just stop get a deep wake up get out
of that frame of mind and look at
what's Bigger than that one narrative
you've pushed for the last eight
Ps Vance: years now So we're on
the series of discipleship, right?
Um these past couple weeks and so
what's interesting is that the great
commission is very clear It's it's
actually not to go and make believers.
It's to go and make disciples.
Exactly, right?
Obviously that's connected.
Um, but I I had this thought of like You
know in In settings where obviously, you
know, I have employees that work for me
that don't believe in Jesus yet, right?
Hopefully they will have
opportunities to and if God can use
me to do that, that'd be amazing.
But you know, maybe 70 percent
believe in Jesus in my company,
maybe 30%, let's say for example.
Um, but can I still make disciples?
Cause you know, disciples
of Jesus is very specific.
You have to believe in Jesus, but
disciples, that term is just a follower.
Right.
Um, and so I just think it's interesting.
I know the ultimate commission
is followers in Jesus.
I just thought it was an interesting
thought around, Oh, in general though.
Like, are you leading in a way
where you're influential enough,
where people can be influenced,
where people can follow?
You know what I mean?
Ps Adam: Well, I think disciples, I
mean, you've got digital disciples,
you've got crypto disciples.
I mean, it depends what your
field of discipleship is.
My field is very clear.
Everything is geared towards leading
people to Christ because I want
to make people followers of Jesus.
The way that Paul presented
it, follow me, follow Christ.
So, I want my leadership to
Point them towards Christ.
I think, you know, the great commission is
go meet disciples, baptizing them in the
name of the father, son, the Holy spirit.
So it's disciples of Jesus.
Um, I, I have got, uh, people in my
world who aren't believers, but there
is a, a very clear agenda that I have
there that I want to lead them to Jesus.
So I can't just keep them as a
friend and go, well, I'm not going
to bother evangelizing to them or.
Influencing them.
It can't just be a friend.
Like my neighbor, I
can't just be a neighbor.
I'm talking to him about
Jesus all the time.
I'm talking about what I do as a minister.
I'm, I've got a very clear
pathway to, to discipleship.
I don't have friends that aren't
Christians just to have friends.
Ps Vance: Yeah.
And, and that's, that's, that's
really, that's really good.
I think the, um, the work context is also
interesting as well in that, can you even
have certain principles, values, policies
within your team or your company to where
it leads to flourishing because it's
aligned with biblical principle, right?
I can't, I can't convince you, I
can't force you to believe in Jesus,
but maybe if I have a level of
leadership or influence to be able to.
set policies.
And that's what's exciting, right?
What's exciting about What we
have an opportunity for in the
next four years is that okay?
Not everybody in America tomorrow
is gonna believe in Jesus.
Yeah, but can we continue
to vote in policies?
Can we continue to vote in values
that will lead to maximum flourishing?
Yeah.
Ps Adam: Yeah I think if you hire people
who aren't believers You have just put
a huge responsibility on your life to
live in such a high level of reputation.
There you go That, that you model Jesus.
So that's, you've just put pressure
on your life because now I'm
the only Jesus they're seeing.
So the way that they're going to ever
think of Jesus is me as a Christian,
as the example, at least if you hire
Christians, they've got other examples of
Christian leaders and pastors and whatnot.
But if you hire non Christians, that's
huge pressure because I'm not, It
would be sad of a Christian employer.
And if you're building a business and
you've got non believers, what a sad
reality would be, I'm just going to
use them to build my business, right?
You should be using your
business to win them.
Yeah, that should be the goal.
If there's a goal in there and,
and maybe it's, you're right.
You're not going to be like, Hey, here,
we're all Christians and you better.
No, it's like, but this is.
These are the values.
Beautiful.
This is what we believe.
This is how we're going to operate.
If you don't like that, then, um,
God bless you in your next venture.
But if you can handle
this, come on the journey.
Yeah.
Ps Michelle: Yeah.
I think even when you follow that verse
all the way through, it says, you know,
go make disciples, baptizing them.
And then he also says, teaching them
to obey everything I've commanded.
So good.
And I think that teaching them to obey
part, like, A disciple is someone who
follows, but also obeys what Jesus does.
And to your point earlier, it's
like, yeah, you can set up, I think,
environments where you have policies
that align or principles in the business
world or in, in the governmental world
where you can, it's like, I can create
an atmosphere that makes it easier for
you to teach, um, So you can obey Christ,
and there will be environments that will
make it very hard for you to obey Christ
because of the policies in place, because
of the, and so, you know, for people, to
your point earlier, for Christians that
are like, well, what's gonna happen?
One thing I say is that I seem to
resonate with people that voted the
other way was, I really do think
it's going to be much easier to be
a Christian for the next four years.
For sure.
Like you're going to be able to really
walk out your values in a very open
way that would not have been possible.
Yeah, um, and so that's probably
another problem, you know, in the
business context taking that lens
is what atmosphere am I creating?
Ps Adam: But I think my appeal from this
particular pod post election is i'm just
appealing to christians Yeah, christians
who didn't maybe vote a certain way.
They they're upset right now I'm, just
if this could be my one appeal maybe
just take a breath You Open your eyes and
consider what you haven't seen consider
what it can you break it down then
consider what the majority of the country?
Saw that you are completely
bamboozled by right now
Ps Michelle: What what break that
down like if they're listening right
now, okay, what am I not seeing?
Ps Adam: Well, it's it's more what
you're not able to see beyond which
is this gas lighting about Uh, racism
and misogyny and, you know, uh, white
supremacy and, uh, you know, January
6th, rioting, all that gaslighting
crap, felony, all that angled.
Isn't it funny?
Uh, uh, who's the guy
was prosecuting Trump?
Um, PAC, is it, uh, in New York?
Yeah.
Uh, well, the DOJ just
fired him, by the way.
Uh, what's his name?
Ps Michelle: Oh.
Oh.
Ps Adam: Come on guys, come on, yes
you do, you guys know, fact check,
who, what, oh I love having a fact
checker actually, it's pretty handy.
Is she any good at fact checking?
Um, what's his name?
I think it's Pack, is it?
Is it Pack?
Ps Adam: Oh.
Come on, the guy who's doing
the prosecuting, the special
counsel, the special counsel.
It's not Pack, no.
Pack's somewhere, that's,
that's, someone else.
It's Pack.
Packer
No, no, no, no Come on guys.
Ps Michelle: Jack Smith.
Ps Adam: Jack Smith.
Thank you.
Yeah, Jack Smith special counsel.
Jack Smith Jack not pack.
Jack Smith Actually It's um,
he's the guy who's been you
know, like the pitbull going on.
Yeah.
Well, they just fired him today To
get him out before Trump gets in Okay,
but you know, so there was so much
corruption that people have believed
and now they're like, well, he's a film.
Well, okay.
You've got to, you've got to wake up
and look at all of the situations around
those, uh, those, uh, so called felonies.
And, uh, I think there is in the
trials and how they're winding
down their investigation.
They're
Ps Adam: not going to be pushing for
trial and all that kind of stuff.
So, oh, hello.
Um, now is the moment to go.
Oh, isn't it funny how
it's all falling apart?
If it was true, they'd be pushing through.
Yeah.
So i'm just i'm i want to
make this appeal to go.
Hey get deeper Go a little bit
deeper than the surface level.
How would you recommend
Ps Michelle: they go deeper?
Ps Adam: I think Probably just do
your own research and investigation.
Probably first thing is get out of your
echo chamber of cancel culture I think
what goes with the left is cancel culture.
So the moment someone doesn't say what
you have heard, you've canceled them.
You've just literally shrunk your world
to a small pinhole of, of narrative.
Widen the aperture, widen the aperture
and start listening to, uh, conversations,
Paul, uh, podcasts or different things
that will give you a broader understanding
where you can actually exercise some
thought, challenge some thought.
Um, maybe start to build a different
feed from, uh, MSNBC or something like
that, you know, get, get, uh, daily
wire or just get, you know, some,
some thought leaders in the space
that would maybe just provoke you.
If it provokes you, it's
probably a good thing.
Yeah.
It probably get, if he gets you a
little bit triggered, it's a good
thing, but see if your argument
can hold water in conversation.
What I found even with the town hall.
Is, you know, sometimes people can
submit questions bold online, but
when they have to actually do it in a
conversation, all the energy gets sucked
in because now I'm hearing me say it
and it doesn't actually make sense when
it comes out of my mouth and I have to
be able to hold it in a conversation.
So get out of the online
warrior mode and get into actual
Ps Vance: conversation with people.
For leaders that are listening to
this, uh, because entrepreneurs,
there might be even other pastors.
How did the town hall go?
Fantastic.
Yeah, it was, Arthur was a brilliant.
What did you like about it?
Ps Michelle: Well, ask Michelle.
She was there.
Um, so, so the, just so you know, the
format, we basically had, uh, people
submit, like ask questions live of,
you know, of past item primarily.
And he, he could just respond to it as,
as they, I think it was your mountain
view and we focused it really here's
the, I think Michelle was up there.
I was, I was up there.
She was the antagonist.
I was trying to be, but you know, You want
to let me, um, but, um, but we focused it.
Here's, I think here's the key is
you need people in the room that are
invested in the community, right?
Because if you just open it up to
people that are willing to tear
down what you're trying to build,
it's not a fair conversation.
It's not.
So you had people that had different,
like trying to genuinely understand,
generally learn, they may not quite
understand, may not quite agree, but
these were leaders and things like that.
So that already, I think, set
the tone of the town hall.
So.
The way they would ask questions
came with a level of, um, just, you
know, generally trying to understand.
I think, yeah, I think, I think a lot
of people got clarity at least on where,
where, where we stood as leadership.
Ps Vance: Where was the themes
that people were touching on?
I
Ps Adam: think one of the biggest
themes that was shocking to people
is they believe that, uh, Republicans
is a white evangelical party.
Yeah.
But what they saw in the room was
probably 2 percent of the people.
White.
Yeah.
And hang on.
These are a lot of Christians that
aren't white evangelicals, but they're
people of color who have got deep
intelligence, conviction, um, and it was,
I think that was a bit of a challenge.
Ps Michelle: Yeah.
I think so.
I mean our community specifically
is fairly racially diverse.
And so you It's sort of hard to sort
of perpetuate narratives about what a
republican looks like or what a trump
voter looks like That's cool Because you
can't you you're literally like going to
church with these people that you love
and you know, all that stuff So I think
it was I think it was I I I probably would
have wanted it to go a little bit Spicy.
Spicy?
I think so.
I think people were just for the
first 'cause it was our first one.
So I think it tip tone a bit.
A little bit.
I, yeah.
'cause I could see the question
would within the question,
like there was one question.
Yeah.
They talked about the whitening
bed General closed a little bit.
Or the question about, um, abor,
like the initial questions about
abortion and then the, what's a
Ps Vance: deeper part of that though?
So it's like, oh, because I think
this is what the party is, I'm
not gonna be represented in how
the government cares for me.
Is that.
Yeah, the deeper point because like that
also still seems a little bit surface.
I'm not trying to minimize their
feelings about it I'm just saying it
still seems a little bit surface, right?
Ps Michelle: Yeah, I think there's
an thinking that white evangelicals
have a Have a power I suppose in the
Republican Party got it that other Other
that will ignore them that will ignore
them, which is why Kamala primarily
she did go to a lot of churches But
they were all black churches, right?
Right, right, right.
And so primarily democratic churches
Tend to be African American.
Okay.
Um, and so, yeah, so if you were to
say like pick a church and say, guess
the party, if you looked at the racial
makeup, you'd probably guess red or
blue just based on that and be right.
Maybe eight out of 10 times.
Um, so I think there is that thinking
is that like, Oh, I actually don't see
people that look like me in this party.
I don't really see, but to the point
of like going deeper, it's, but
do you hear what you believe in?
Being said by this party, and maybe,
yes, there was, and historically there
was a point, I think, Republicans, um,
Forgot to look up and look at what what
does our nation look like and sure do we
actually have everyone at the table here?
That probably still have the same
beliefs and values um I know black
conservatives who've had a hard time
breaking to the republican party because
there have been a little bit of barriers
there But they're still pushing through
and I think you've seen at the rnc.
It was way more diverse than i've ever
seen it be um But I do think the one
thing about Republic is that they,
they, they're like, we believe this.
We're not going to just do
tokenism for the sake of it.
We're on the other side.
They will a thousand percent be like,
we're going to look like, you know,
we care about what you're saying.
I would have
Ps Adam: liked, I would definitely
like that to be a little bit
more spicy too, but you know.
It's the first time you did it first
time, yeah However, my look just
closing thoughts my takeaways are from
this election next cycle election.
Let's get rid of polls Let's get rid of
let's put a cap on how much you can spend
in campaigning Let's, um, do voter ID.
That's what I just think.
How, how, how is that like a thing?
Like, why, why,
Ps Vance: why would we have voter ID?
That's
Ps Adam: so crazy.
That's why I think
we've saved the country.
I really, I know it sounds dramatic, but
I think this election saved the country.
I think that if the election
went the other way, it would
have just opened borders.
We would have flooded legal immigrants.
It would have maximized fast track
citizenship to vote a particular way.
Then, uh, I think different states
would have been doubled down.
You can look how close some
of the states still were.
I know it was like read across the board,
but some within a hundred thousand.
Oh yeah.
And if you've got 15 million illegal
immigrants coming through that can
get citizenship and voting status.
Then they obviously gonna
lean a particular way.
You've literally flooded the what was
the gap in the popular vote 20 million?
Ps Vance: Uh, I don't know
what the exact count is.
Yeah.
Yeah, it was a wide gap closer than that.
It was closer But yeah,
yeah, but it was so
Ps Adam: 15 million over one over of
what last three or four years Over
the next four years could be way
more if it had gone the other way,
Ps Michelle: but here's the thing.
I still Are we now do we now
have faith again in our democracy
system after last night?
Do we believe like because before that
the the no, no, no I don't think it
was like, oh the polls are corrupt.
They're getting but then we saw
this overwhelming majority Is it
that like just so many people showed
up that they couldn't fake it?
Yeah, I think versus in
Ps Michelle: 20
Okay, I think so.
I think that 2020 was closer, right?
Ps Michelle: 2020 was way closer
than this year, for sure, for sure.
But I think, I mean, to the January 6th
insurrections of like, you know, they
stole the election, that narrative.
You got to
Ps Adam: go back and look at Pennsylvania.
Yeah.
It was that sudden overnight.
Yeah.
Yeah.
The stolen election was running
around Georgia and Pennsylvania.
Yeah.
Okay.
And you saw the graph.
And then, okay, last night you
could see, you could call it
from about 60 percent counted.
Yeah,
Ps Adam: after about 60 percent counted.
Yeah, it didn't change much.
Yeah, traditionally historically.
It's always been that way But last
election in Pennsylvania, which decided
the election in the middle of night 2 a.
m It shot up perpendicular.
Yeah, and then overtook and that's
where the election was Hang on.
They can't.
So why did that happen this year?
Because I think they made sure
that they had eyes on everything.
Yeah.
No one was going to sleep.
No one was going to bed.
That's true.
That's true.
Every it was, it was
just too much eyes on it.
That's true.
And I think it was just too convincing.
Mm-Hmm.
. Yeah.
Like the win.
It wasn't narrow enough for
there to be a spike or Yeah.
Or a, or a thing.
I think there was so much scrutiny,
but still, while there is.
No Id to vote.
It is fraudulently open.
It is so easy to fraud.
Mm-Hmm.
. Yeah.
It's, it's, it's out.
It's outrageous.
Ps Vance: Yeah.
On that, my takeaway is I still don't know
why we're voting with pen and paper . Um,
so, and the hype network, if somebody
can work on that, that'd be great.
But I think it's, the pen and paper is
Ps Adam: the hard one to.
Fraud.
Fraud.
Yeah.
Yeah.
But we do digital, digital
Ps Vance: banking.
We do digital like transfers all day long.
We have a ton of issues with that.
No, there's a ton of fraud, but
there are ways to do, like, I don't
think that in the next 10 to 20
years it's gonna be pen and paper.
You guys think it's
gonna be pen and paper?
I think that's the move,
I think, I think the
Ps Adam: only way to actually
de fraudulent defraud anyway,
to keep it fraud free.
Yeah.
Is if every ballot has
a pen and paper and.
It's goes that machine that scans, you
know, like when you did your multiple
Ps Vance: choice, you
know, back in the day.
Yeah.
Well, if somebody can figure out how to
keep that same fraud rate with digital
massive opportunity, I'm just saying,
I'm just saying massive opportunity.
I mean, the more we
Ps Adam: go online, unless it's
like there's some blockchain
solution that does it because
otherwise it's just so hackable.
It's so for sure.
It
Ps Michelle: sounds, yeah, yeah, yeah.
But I'm just trying to
run out in our elections
Ps Vance: and stuff like that.
But if somebody figures it
out, that's a huge opportunity.
Ps Michelle: I don't, I don't know.
I don't trust humanity that well.
But I think, I think never, never
say never check someone's ID.
Be like, Hey, are you?
Yep.
Okay.
But in
Ps Vance: California, they, they weren't.
So you couldn't show your ID.
No,
Ps Adam: they match signatures.
I actually think, I think we go to
a public holiday on election day.
Ps Vance: That'd be
Ps Adam: cool.
That'd be nice.
That mail in.
Voting is only for a, a certain reason.
Yeah.
You know, like you have to,
it's like you have a, you're
Ps Vance: saying fraud rates are higher.
But
Ps Adam: I think it's like, so
you know how you have like a,
um, a handicap parking thing.
I think those situations also lend
to mail in voting specifically.
I think it's a public holiday.
You show up to ballots, the lines,
you just open up more ballots.
So.
Churches, we could open up the church here
to do like, you know, have, have a ballot
box station, that kind of stuff, system.
I think there is definitely ways to do it.
Ps Michelle: You make it like a whole day.
Ps Adam: Yeah, make it a whole day.
Make it a festival.
Ps Vance: Election festival.
Your closing thoughts, Michelle?
Ps Michelle: Um, actually, I wanted to
hear who you guys think 2028 will be.
Ps Vance: Really?
You're already thinking about 2028?
No, JD
Ps Michelle: Vance.
Everyone's, yeah, okay, JD Vance and who?
Oh, uh, yeah, who's he's running?
Maybe maybe maybe yeah,
Ps Vance: JD
Ps Michelle: and Vivek.
Let's go Yeah, that'd be power on
the on the democratic ticket because
you know, they're working on that
I don't know if there's anybody.
I
Ps Adam: think new
Ps Michelle: sims in the running.
Oh, I think you sir
Ps Vance: Well, maybe we
can get a new governor then.
That'd be great
Because he's our president, I don't know.
I don't know.
No, because he's so busy.
Yeah
Ps Michelle: I don't know.
Or running.
Yeah.
You don't think, do you
think Kamala will run again?
Ps Vance: No.
You think she's not?
No, there's no way.
The DNC won't let her.
No.
She lost so bad.
There's no way.
No.
Ps Adam: No.
I don't even think she's going
to have a role in politics
Ps Michelle: after this.
Newsome and who?
Oh,
Ps Adam: um, is it the, um, that Shapiro?
Isn't that Shapiro?
Oh yeah, that guy.
Josh Shapiro.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I think he's super popular.
Except if that's, if the Democrat will let
a, a Jewish person in any sort of power.
Sure.
Ps Michelle: Yeah.
I think, yeah, they might.
Ps Adam: Oh, I hope they don't let him
because he's actually really, Michelle.
Ps Michelle: Oh, you think?
Oh, I think Obama.
Newsome Obama.
I think so.
Oh, I don't.
I was watching her on this.
She was real vocal for someone that
doesn't want to be in politics.
Ps Adam: Yeah.
But it didn't move the needle.
No.
Ps Michelle: Because she, I mean,
she's only so much she can do.
She's pushing her, but I, I, I,
Ps Adam: let's see.
Yeah.
Let's see.
I think it really depends on economic
factors at the end of this four years.
Yeah.
Where is the economy sitting?
In two years.
Ps Michelle: I think in two years.
He's got two years.
Ps Adam: Yeah.
You're probably right.
Two, two to three.
Two.
Because the last year is campaigning.
Exactly.
Ps Vance: I'm going to prophesy right now.
Third term for Trump.
Third term.
Third term.
Project 2025.
Maybe Trump
Ps Adam: changes the policy
or term running for president.
Oh, that just fed somebody.
Yeah.
All right.
I love it.
Bless you guys.
Well,
Ps Vance: podcast 78.
It was great.
It
was great.
